Need some boat seat advice??

[hdflame]

Hey guys, and gals!  I need some guidance on pricing a boat seat job.  There are two single bucket seats, one single low back seat, and a couple of pedestal seats that I forgot to take pictures of.  I have absolutely no idea of how much to charge for this job since it's my first boat.

Just recovering all the seats back to original is the plan.  The guy had his driver seat blow out while towing it down the road and scuffed it up pretty good.  He originally talked to me about just replacing the wooden bottom that had rotted and was the cause of it blowing out.  Now he's looking at recovering everything so it'll match! 

I want to give him a price for just the one driver seat, then a price for the whole job.  I know prices vary by region, but I'd appreciate some advice so I have a starting point.  I have 2 local shops that I might be able t o get a quote from but I haven't contacted them yet.  I just went and looked at the job this morning, so nobody will be open till Monday.

One other thing, any recommendations on vinyl that would work good in this application?  Anybody have any favorites in a mid range price that will compare to the original material?

Here's some pics.

The first pics are the seat that blew out.






This is what's left of the 1/2" plywood base.  It also had vinyl covering it.


The other seats.  In the first picture you can see one of the pedestal seats turned upside down behind the built in seats.  There are two of them and I think they had a bottom with a flip up separate back.  I'll have to go and have another look to be sure.

[Mojo]

I can see from the pic's your going to have some extra sewing because of the panels within the seats. So plan for a little more measuring and cutting. The seats I did for my own boat had panels and it was more work.

Mike and June like Seabrook. Mike has some good deals on vinyl so contact him to see if he has anything on sale.

I cannot help you on price since I do not do marine work. June will be able to give you a good idea as she does a lot of interior work ( and is awesome at it too ). Mike can help you with price as well.

Let us know if you get the job.

Chris

[Cathy111]

I have done a few boat seats and each style has a difference price. You have to figure vinyl cost, how long it takes to remove the covers, make/cut patterns, make weld cording (there's a lot of weld cording on these seats), sew together and re-staple. Sewing time will be more because of all the insert panels (20 pieces just on the front of one bucket seat in the pic). If the wood is still good on the seats, great. But if you have to replace any you'll have to charge labor for cutting a new one and supple cost (stainless steel staples/screws and marine plywood are not cheap). Does any of the foam have to be replaced/repaired? Don't forget to figure your labor time if you remove and reinstall the seats on the boat. Be realistic about your labor hours and material cost and don't sell yourself short. None of us like to work for nothing. I tell my customers it could cost as high as $$$ or as low as $$$ and explain the difference is because sometimes you just don't know until you tear it apart. Good luck, hope I helped out a little.

[JuneC]

Whoa, lots of pieces there!  I'd have to say somewhere around $1400 to $1700, having not seen the pedestal seats.   Probably $500 less than that without all those seams.   And extra for replacing any structure or foam.  Also, the buckets seem to be sewn with 1/2 or greater sew foam - difficult for pieced panels.  When I see all that foam sticking out around the staples, warning bells go off in my head.  You "THINK" the foam is on the seat - when you get the covers off, you find the seat is bare-bones plastic and the foam was on the vinyl.  Meaning, simply enough, you have to deal with it in your new skins. 

I did one of those type seats once on a Regal bowrider and got burned big time.  Thought I could get away with 1/4" sew foam under the vinyl, only to find out the old skins had some 1/4", some 1/2" and some 1".  PITA to cut and sew and make it look right.  The seat was bare NAKED when I yanked the old vinyl off   :-[

June

[Mike8560]

it looks like to me maybre two buvket seat with e little filler seat inbetween then prob;y 2 fishing seats with fold down back?
id say $300 for each bucket then probly $150 for the folddowns the copnnctor probly anopther 150  i asume the fold downs are two toned also  privces dont indlude anythoing but the vinyl  and i only use seabrook. 

[hdflame]

Thanks to everybody for the advice.  I knew I could get some guidance here! ;D

Well, I see the problems you're pointing out and I definitely don't want to underbid the job and wind up eating it!  Looks like Mike and June are a good ways apart on price....Mike about $750 and June about twice that much.  So, I'm thinking maybe somewhere in between??

Before I give any quote, I'm going to try a couple of local shops too.  I know how much prices can vary by region.

I'd love to give this job a go, just for the practice, but I don't want to get into it and like June said happened to her, have it bite me in the butt by underbidding.

June, I see exactly what you're talking about with the foam sticking out around the edges on the seat bottom.  I would never have even thought twice about the foam being attached to the vinyl! ???  If I'm understanding you correctly, you're thinking that when I pull the covers that all of the foam will come off with them?  Would that mean that I'll need to replace all of the foam?  These seemed thicker than just having sew foam on them.  I haven't taken one apart, but it looks like that's what I'll have to do to be sure.  I think the flip up pedestal fishing seats are the thinner sew foam like you said.  I can see in the picture where the cover snaps on, in order to remove it....I guess for cleaning or replacing??

Mike, if I'm understanding you correctly, the price you gave was only doing the vinyl work and didn't include replacing any foam or wood?

I'm sorry to say that I didn't look at the pedestal seats close enough because originally he was only thinking about replacing the rotted wood on the bottom of the driver's seat....until the wind blew it out and scuffed up the vinyl.

Just a couple more questions.  What would you guys guess, or how should I figure how many yards of vinyl to order?  I'm thinking about a yard of the tan color, about a yard of the grey, and about a 1/2 yard of the red per seat.  Would that put me close, then add a couple yards of each...just in case?

Mike, I see you only use Seabrook.  What is the reason?

June, do you have a preference on vinyl?

Oh well, I'm not going to underprice this because I feel sorry for his mistake....then it would become my mistake!

Thanks again.  I'll keep you guys posted and hopefully I'll be posting some pics in the "Green" Room and not in the "JUNK" Room! :-[

[Allan]

Bobby

Don't stress over the cost too much do your quote and don't worry if it is an hour or two one way or the other
Just make sure you cover your costs and treat your labour as a learning curve being your first of this type of job
You will make something out of the labour but keep in mind that the next job you do like this you will be bang on the money when it comes to quoting.

Good luck with the job

Allan

[baileyuph]

Bobby,
Help me out, I read June to include materials in her pricing and Mike said he would have to add materials.  If so, they aren't that far apart, remember foam today is expensive too.

There is one bunch of work in a project like this,  I just finished five boat interiors.  I am ready for a few simple repair jobs. ;)

Check the previous post, what do I know.   :)

Doyle

[Mike8560]

Bobby the 150 was per seat I meant I figure two big seats a d two small

Seabrook is what I have a sila le from Miami and another and I like it I have more of a color section the my other distance Carry  tons of colors were  other ventir only have a same card of colors. 
Not to mention some are heavier a d lighter

[Highvelocity]

With those bucket seats being 2 colors and a design and piped I agree with Mike,,$300 for each.  That layout would chew up my time...  It looks like a good challenge though, to see how close you can get it to factory.  Your definatly going to have some time in on this job I think.

[stew-cheryl]

I'm in the same ballpark as June 1400 - 1700 plus repair to base.  Seabrook and lately Naugahyde vinyl. And around 40 for the embroidery

[hdflame]

OK guys, I wanted to report back on this and also ask for some more help.

Right now I'm doing just the one seat that was damaged, but I feel certain that he's going to want the others done when I finish with this one.

Here's the problem I've got.  I finished sewing everything together and started to staple it down and my staples aren't holding! ???

I'm using a BEA stapler with SS staples 3/8 crown and 3/8 length.  I thought that the staples I pulled out of it were the same size, but mine don't seem to want to stay put.  What do I need to do?  Do I need a larger stapler or just longer staples? 

These are hard plastic seats.







These are pics I took as I tore it down.

You can see in these pics the area that's giving me trouble, (Well, it's where I started)  Don't know if you can tell the size of the original staples or not, but there was a couple of areas that were a larger size.  The staples close to the staple puller were a larger gauge and longer.  They were only in a couple of high stress areas.

I think most of the them were the size I have now....but not sure.  What do you guys recommend?

[Mojo]

Bobby:

June or Mike maybe able to help you more then I can as they have done these plastic composite sat frames.

But from my own experience:

I use 1/2 inch crown x 3/8ths stainless staples on everything. I did some boat seats once using 3/8 crown staples and the fabric would pull straight through the staples. I also like the 1/2 inch because I am not making as many holes in the fabric. This is very important when doing vinyl. I just finished a dash wrap job where some areas had to be stapled close together so the 1/2 inch crown helped cut down on the holes.

I take it that the staples are seating well against the fabric  ? If not then you may want to increase your pressure a bit. I typically staple at 70 - 80 lbs when going into plywood but have had to turn up the pressure to 100 lbs going into plastic.

Go back and look at the staples carefully to see if they are seating well and are tight against the fabric. If not then increase our pressure.

Hopefully June and Mike will jump in here as well.

Chris

[JuneC]

Bobby, is your vinyl cut too small?  The area at the bottom of the seat back should be tight over the foam, but not excessive.  Most of your pull will be left to right, not up/down.  If you look at the first photo, you'll see there's actually excess vinyl at the bottom where it's stapled.  The seat bottom will help hold it all in place. 

Also, the staple pictured in your last pic by the puller is at least 1/2" long, maybe 5/8".  Look at the crown - pretty sure it's a 3/8" crown.  Compare that length to the length of the leg.  I'd say the leg is at least 1/8" longer than the crown, maybe 2/8. 

You could probably do it with 3/8" staples, but it'll require more of them than what you pulled out.  Just hold the vinyl in place till you get a dozen or so stapled so they "share the load". 

June

[hdflame]

Thanks guys... :D and gals!

OK, let me answer some of your responses.  First off, sounds like I need to get another stapler for marine and/or plastic seats....Suggestions?  But, my pressure is around 80 psi and is shooting them all the way in.  I actually had a problem with too much pressure causing the staples too cut through the vinyl on another job, so I dialed it down a bit.

June, the staple you're looking at in the picture is one I wanted you to see for comparison.  They had used that bigger staple in some stress areas and only when they were stapling through the vinyl AND the welt cord.  Basically it was just where they were putting a little more strain pulling on the welt and needed extra hold.  Not sure, cause I've thrown them away, but I think the other staples were about the same size as the ones I'm using now.  You are definitely correct on them being bigger.  I was hoping that I could get away with just using extra staples in the stress points.

After, reading what you said about not pulling too tight, I think part of my problem may be technique.  I was pulling pretty tight to make sure that the back was pulling any wrinkles out.  I'll try it without as much pulling.  I didn't think about the bottom holding it down.

OK, now one more question.  This seat has slots molded in the bottom for the bolts to hold it down.  I didn't remove the seat from the boat, so I'm thinking that the way the bottom is made will allow you to pull it up from the back in order to access the bolts.  Is that right?

this is the bottom side of the seat bottom.  It had a piece of plastic stapled to it so the you could grab it and pull it up to access the bolts...I think.  Is that right?


It also had strips of vinyl sewed to the bottom so it could be pulled throught the slots and stapled to the bottom.




I was working on this late last night, and when it wasn't working right I just decided to post my questions on here before going to bed.  Ya'll have saved me again....THANKS! ;D  I'm going to go try it again.

Just an after thought.  I have a larger staple gun that I use for woodworking.  I know I don't have any SS staples for it and not sure if I can get SS in that size, but I wonder if I used some of those bigger staples for the initial hold and then followed up with the SS in the smaller size??  Would that be OK, or should I just stick with the 3/8" stainless I have?

Thanks a bunch for the help.