"Tire kickers"

[bobbin]

Brutal customer.  All about price. Lazy about looking at suggested fabrics (because he has no clue how much they cost since it's from a wholesale house!) and "pushing the envelope" with respect to time and ordering nice samples for him to look over. 

I have been more than patient and finally sent a reply e-mail that was terse and "to the point".  And still I feel uncomfortable!  How do you guys deal with this sort of thing?  When do you "blow them off" and how do you do it POLITELY?

[MinUph]

Make appointments with them and make sure your not there when they come by LOL. Hey after all they wasted your time.

  I've never been able to do what you ask. I am either very patient or I get stupid so I stay patient. I feel for ya.

[SteveA]

If they're brutal micro managers trying to come in under budget - I show disinterest in the work - that either gets them to commit or gets them to leave.  Otherwise if they are just quirky or undecided - I give them all the time they need.  Those folks become your friend and loyal customer.
SA

[kodydog]

Lazy about looking at suggested fabrics (because he has no clue how much they cost since it's from a wholesale house!)

Dealing with time killing customers is a PITA but comes with owning your own business. They will show up from time to time. When it gets to the point of pulling hair out of your head its time stop paying so much attention to them or just flat out ignore them. The do-it -yourselfers who think nothing of taking two hours of your time asking questions are a good example. I often send these people to this forum but have never seen one show up.

The one thing I don't understand about your scenario is why are the wholesale house fabrics not priced?

[sofadoc]

The one thing I don't understand about your scenario is why are the wholesale house fabrics not priced?

Some wholesale websites do not list prices unless an authorized retail account holder (such as me) logs in to view them. I wish they were ALL that way.   

[kodydog]

So Bobbin is ordering samples to show her customer but can't give him a price? I still don't understand.

[JuneC]

I think what she means is that the tire-kicker wants to know her margin on the samples she's showing.  He doesn't know what her cost is, so can't (or won't) decide.  Some people want to know if they're paying you what they consider to be an unfair profit.

I don't encounter many of these types in marine work, but I just inch away from the time-burning activities they seem to cause.  I give them the quote, sometimes several quotes, based on requirements and leave it to them.  Some never return, but some just have a difficult time making a decision because of the $$ involved. 

June 

[kodydog]

So not only is he eating up precious time but is trying to kill her profit also. Time to dump the Bozo.

[sofadoc]

I think what she means is that the tire-kicker wants to know her margin on the samples she's showing.  He doesn't know what her cost is, so can't (or won't) decide.  Some people want to know if they're paying you what they consider to be an unfair profit.

Kinda like the "cat & mouse" game played at a jewelry store. You can't decide because the prices are on that microscopic itty-bitty tag underneath the box.  ;)

There is a certain element of mystery involved with our type of work. The customer has no concept of what the job should cost. So they want all the facts and figures before them so THEY can decide what your profit should be.

Most people would be shocked to learn just how little a pair of glasses costs to make. Yet they pay the man hundreds of dollars for a few dollars worth of lens and plastic frame. Why didn't they insist on seeing his wholesale cost?   

[bobbin]

Yes, what June and Sofa. said.  I have had great luck with Douglass Fabrics and their site does not show prices without a customer number.  Their sample cards are pretty standard fare, with tiny "samples" that're pretty useless but they've been very nice about sending requested samples.   I grommet the corners and have started my own "binder".  I just sold a very nice job with their fabrics (customer was the opposite of the tire kicker... the sort of customer Steve A. described, actually). 

The customer in question is all about price, "what are you going to do for me?" (increase the bid every time I'm asked that question, that's what I'm going to do for you, buddy).  I have done everything I've said I'd do but he never seemed quite satisfied and always wanted "more".  We've been playing this game since early October.  I've put in considerable time to locate and suggest appropriate samples, quantify the foam options, and my labor.  But he never "had time" to look at the on-line suggestions (give me a break), for precisely the reason June offered, I suspect.  I finally said there was no point in making an appointment with no samples of reasonable size to view but if he wished he was free to purchase any fabric that suited him from any source.   I'd be happy to work with it, though I'd assume no liability/responsibility for its relative suitability.  I think that might have "gotten his attention" and sent a strong message that we need to "get to the dance floor" or I'll be looking for a new partner!

I have a pretty long rope when it comes to this sort of thing because I understand how hard it can be for some people to picture how something is going to look when it's finished.  And I agree with Steve that an investment in time and thoughtful discussion can win people over and forge a relationship.  I also understand "sticker shock" with respect to fabric.  A lot of people don't understand how expensive nice quality fabric is, esp. when you move into the realm of marine and hospitality upholstery.  I make time to discuss this with them and point out the relative benefits of the fabrics I can offer. That said, I did a "spot test" on some Crypton treated fabric from Douglass.  I "stained" it with red wine, sunscreen, and oil from canned tuna fish.  I treated it as directed and every one of the stains came out. I am impressed, you guys!

[baileyuph]

Marketing is a challenge, especially when you have work on the bench and a tire kicker on the scene.

How to deal, well being nice and letting them know if there are more questions and effort will be made to gather answers while you also let them know that work has to keep going out.  Best to not be rude.

Doyle

[jojo]

I'll bet he's the type of guy who goes to a nice restaurant and orders a $3.00 side salad and a glass of water and then keeps asking for refills on the free bread. And stays at the table for 90 minutes.

[bobbin]

He's the kind of person who seems to think that everyone is out to gouge him and charge him too much.  I don't really don't like the mindset and I particularly dislike the constant "quizzing" about price; he has the estimate in front of him...  just needs to look at it.  Nice enough guy, but he spends too much time "researching" and not enough time trusting that skilled tradesmen know how much it costs to deliver a nice product.  (seems like a waste of energy to me).  (made me laugh, Jojo).

[byhammerandhand]

This sounds like a good argument to give just an overall price and not break down labor, individual materials cost, etc.  What's this $12 for misc. material cost?  And this $4 for decorative tacks?

He's the kind of person who seems to think that everyone is out to gouge him and charge him too much.  I don't really don't like the mindset and I particularly dislike the constant "quizzing" about price; he has the estimate in front of him...  just needs to look at it.  Nice enough guy, but he spends too much time "researching" and not enough time trusting that skilled tradesmen know how much it costs to deliver a nice product.  (seems like a waste of energy to me).  (made me laugh, Jojo).

[baileyuph]

Bottom line would be a better marketing strategy, some of these tire kickers might still kick.

Doyle