General Business Question

[Mike]

Just a comment, web sites can work for you, but they are not needed always, particularly when the busienss is established, reputable, and has plenty of customers locally.  If the market is beyond local, my judgement says they can be an asset and essential.

I tend to agree. Unless you have a product that can be shipped out, a website should be targeted locally. My website could be a lot more professionally designed than it is. But that would involve a much greater $$$ investment. And I just don't think that I would see a return on that investment.

For local businesses, a website can take the place of a full-page ad in the Yellow Pages at a fraction of the cost. For small shops that only cater to local customers, I think a website is nice to have. I just wouldn't go overboard with one. Just show your product and services, along with whatever basic info you want the customer to see.

But like Doyle says, if you already have a well-established business with a high-visibility location, and you aren't looking to expand regionally, I'm don't think that a website will make a significant difference in your life.

bobbin ,
sofa what are your address I don't see them in your profiles.  I used ti think the same way why a world wide web for only local, then I moved here and I do have repeat customers not like I did in NH.
a lot of people here are new to the area and find my website looking for work. a lot of newbys here now I feel like a old local . but it does expand my market. last winter I did a 6k enclosure on abpat an hour away in ft myers beach. in the past ive been to treasure island near tampa 11/2 hours away for 7k Gulfport 6k a few years ago and got a neighbors boat at the marina for the same  so for a 100 buck about a year a website is way better then a yellow page add for me and you can display your work.

[MinUph]

Ditto on what Mike said.
  We have a site that brings work in. The boss has been in business for over 25 yrs. and the site brings in new people. In large metropolis areas it is hard to find business's. Seems foolish but its true. I've always been in favor of a presents. For the money its is foolish not to.

[Mike]

In regards to your website I would be more then happy to review it for you and make suggestions.
I am always willing to confidentially review any of your marketing materials ( off the forum ) and lend advice and make suggestions. Simply drop me an e-mail. I have helped several forum members here in the past and enjoy doing so. In case your wondering I never charge anyone. None of us on this site have any money anyways. :)

Feel free to PM me if you have questions or need me to look something over. Marketing to most people is frustrating and I understand this. I find sewing frustrating..:)

Chris

Chris was very helpful and gave me some great pointed I used on my website

Paul looks like the boss has 6 locations? wow

[sofadoc]

For the money its is foolish not to.

I totally agree. The website is a much better value for the money than most any other form of advertising. Especially the Yellow pages.

I may have done a poor job expressing my thoughts regarding websites in my previous post. But I still that contend that a website may not make a significant difference given certain circumstances.

For me, it has not only brought a lot of e-mail inquiries, but generated a ton of cushion replacement and recliner repair jobs.
These are 2 services that I consider "fast money".

But even if a website only generated 1 job a year, you still recoup your investment. And for you guys that live in a highly competitive area, you can't afford not to have one.

But I know some local small business owners that have spent thousands of $$$ on their website. Not necessarily smart if you ask me.

[baileyuph]

Yellow page listings are free here.  If you want an ad, they are at a cost.

Most people in this area go to a listing get the phone number and address.  They call to verify they can get it done and when.  A good shop location brings business to the door.

Doyle 

[bobbin]

I have not linked my website to this site.  I am not ready to do that because I'm not yet pleased enough with it. 

I have lots of experience (30+ yrs.) but those years were spent "workin' for the man" and I've been really lax about photographing work I've done privately.  What pictures I have are really pretty crummy.  I'm not all that interested in taking a photography class right now.  I think hiring a pro. and having the things I'd  like shot would be more productive. 

I agree that a website for an busy, ESTABLISHED business wouldn't be that important.  However, I'm neither of those things!  And my "target market" is young, monied, professionals.  And they use the internet!!!  They don't have land lines, they don't use the Yellow Pages! they use the internet, and they want to see pictures of work.  End of story. 

I need  my website to be an "on demand portfolio".  There are some useful Adult Ed. classes on internet marketing, and website "development" in my community.  I'll take them and see what happens.

Mojo, thank you so much for your very generous offer.  I may well take you up on it.

[Mike]

bobbin I found taking pictures take a lot , digital was neat when I got it no wasted film and my iphone I always have on my and get some good shots , I take a lot amd find a few good ones, like last week I took about 8 and got this one cool shot at sunset on the harbor  I do the same with my work I take al different angles and pick the best

[bobbin]

Mike, I really struggle with lighting.  Much of my work is interior and I find it terribly difficult to get the lighting right.  I don't understand enough about the basic concept and I struggle with the many menus on my (pretty cheap) Canon.  But I keep pluggin' along.  :)

[baileyuph]

Consumers for the most part all ask "how much" meaning they are shopping and looking for price.  The internet has expanded their search for products that can be bought for less.  Young and old, rich and poor, they all do it.

But, the true analysis of how effective selling with a site on the web is, given that business is picked up with a site and it is.  Searches on the inernet not only find web sites, they find listings in the yellow pages.  So, if I was getting jobs from the web, it does not preclude getting the same work from a yellow page listing.

We frequently get business from young and old who have googled to find us and google will look at yellow page listings, specifically within a specified zip code.  So any work being picked up by a site is also in the same market for a simple yellow page listing.

Customers drive up, say I have heard of you, know someone who used you and recommended I call you.  Then, it is often learned that they googled Yellow pages for the number and the address which they entered into their GPS system that allowed them to drive up to the door.  This is very expedient for consumers whose time is important because they can drop off and pick up on the way home after work.

Business analysis requires a perspective from all angles meaning that work comes from any one of them, not only one of them.  Computer savy people will get your listing and/or web.  Therefore, keep in mind you might have gotten the job with either facility or some other way, a brick and mortar, referral, or?

Marketing is important, definitely depends on what you market and where you market.

My style of work, my gosh, it would be inefficient to entertain a market far away that I am not going to get.  Much smarter to take care of the local market and figure out ways to get the work done better and more efficient.  Time is money, need to spend the time on producing something that will pay.

Business is not all about craftsmanship, there are so many dimensions to it, all important.  Mojo said his brother or whatever was a great mechanic but failed twice (or more?).  Why the failure, well Mojo told it was something in a different vernacular like he wouldn't listen and didn't have the act together.  You know, common sense sometimes is what it takes. 

Don't take this as an argument, just a perspective of experience.

Doyle 


   

[bobbin]

I don't take your perspective as an "argument".  I know it's your perspective based on your own experience in business.  My experience, based on my own professional contacts and the input from my younger (monied) clientele tells a different story, that's all. 

I have found the computer one of the tougher things to "master".  Frequently it's been a exercise in frustration and a stern reminder that ability in one's trade is not the only thing necessary for success in other areas!  (you "got that right"!).  But using a computer for bookkeeping and billing? the only way to fly! (in spite of the steep learning curve). 

I think, however, you have missed the salient reason for the necessity of a website for my business, DB.  I have no desire to attempt to "sell" to a distant market, at all.  I am a custom shop and I desire to sell only within a reasonable and limited local market.  I do custom work and I sell quality and convenience (pin fit in a client's home or pattern on a client's yacht).  I don't care a fig about trying to satisfy someone a thousand miles away, not my game.  I need a "portfolio" of my work (in all its facets) that is readily available to my customer base whenever and wherever they may be.  It's a convenience for them and allows them to decide whether or not they are interested enough to call me. 

[sofadoc]

I have not linked my website to this site.  I am not ready to do that because I'm not yet pleased enough with it.

I think that we are all our own worst critics. While I think that my website needs a lot of work, customers tell me several times a week how much they like it. That leads me to the conclusion that the average customer wouldn't know a bad website even if it bit 'em in the ass.  ;)

I'm convinced that a bad website is better than no website at all. Even a poorly designed website will bring in a few extra customers that you wouldn't have got otherwise. And for a small one-man shop, sometimes a few extra customers is all you need.

[bobbin]

I think Sofa., you're pretty much right about that.  But I am fussier than most and until I'm better able to organize and cull some photos and add more photos to the leaner parts of my website I'm not willing to link to it.  Call me "camera shy", but I'm not ready to unveil it just yet. 

[baileyuph]

In my case, I have approximately 40 semester hours of computer science at the grad school level.  My undergraduate degree is solid technical.  Computers I have programmed, learned couple different languages.

In addition, don't get the idea I don't execute on computers, all my invoicing and associated data basing I developed myself.  If I needed a web site, I would get a primer and develop one myself. 

Sofa, you say if a web site brought in a minimum more, it would be justified.  I can bring in a ton of more work by taking care of my large clients, I have several corporate customers whose accounts are growing because I am taking care of them. 

So, your perspectives are Great!! Great for the way you apparently manage your business.  But, you heard it here, not mine.   People who develop web sites have looked at my situation and agree, a web site isn't needed.  It would only be something else to take valuable time from you.  Some see the picture, they admit your skills, experience, and knowledge and management experience, they add -- is not reproduceable.  I envy you, they say if I knew what you do, I wouldn't be selling web sites.  LOL.  I also have a sense of humor.

It can be left there, not being critcal of how you do things, that sounds foolish.

Doyle

[Mojo]

Bobbin:

Whether your business is National based like me or local it doesn't matter. A website is a must now days. What research has proven and all the studies I have reviewed have shown that customers now days like to research the business they patronize BEFORE they buy or place orders.

Like it or not the consumer world is now driven by computers and more importantly the internet. I am always amazed when I get an order via e-mail and then bill the customer through paypal. Later the customer comes up and shakes my hand and introduces himself and there stands a 75 year old senior citizen. So even the seniors are getting tech savy.

I would probably have to close my doors if I removed my website. So many orders come to me after they have reviewed my website. I also use my website as an information warehouse so I can point customers to it and save me the time in answering questions.

I am in the process of hiring a guy to revamp my website. I do not like it and never have. It is time for a professional to go in and write the code. I found a guy who does freelance work and is an expert at it but it is a little dicey as he is a tech for the company my son owns. I am not sure I want to hire one of his employees even though my son gave his blessing and pointed me to him. I just feel it isn't right and it would put alot of stress on the poor guy working for the Dad of his CEO. :)

This guy by the way is using a new web building program that makes it very easy for dummies ,like me to update. You just click, type, remove or move around pictures right online. I think this program is called Concrete.

As I have said before, I will be more then happy to run through what you have and make suggestions all confidentially of course. But either way you really need a website, even if your going to stay local and I am sure you know this which is why your working so hard on it.

[bobbin]

I used to date a very bright, very funny guy who was "all about" computers.  I recall asking him if it would be a wise idea to take a computer programming class (c. 1980).  He laughed and said, no because it would be a waste of time and money.  I've never forgotten that.  He went on to work for a small company called, Apple (and is still there!).  I have LOTS of techie friends.

I have no doubt, DB, that you use computers easily.  Hammer., too.  It's harder for me, but I know I have to do it and I toil ever on.  But the point I feel you've missed entirely is the necessity for a portfolio of my work to be available 24/7.  Your business is established and you don't have the need to build a relationship with higher end interior designers.  I do.  I need to link my work to the young, hip, talented designers, and their monied clientele.  And those people use the internet and cruise websites.