Is it Leather?

[baileyuph]

In the furniture world, we see leather on furniture, corrected to be processed leather.

Leather comes as a hide and synthetic materials on a roll.  I look at what is often referenced as leather, even as processed leather, and I see more synthetic than anything.  Getting to the question, is processed leather as good as quality vinyl.

It sure will snag and even loose it color in short order.  The drying process seems much faster than a quality vinyl.

I am surprised there haven't been problems in calling processed leather, leather.  consumers, IMHO think processed leather is real hide material.

Consumers don't understand much more than the price.  They should understand that a sofa for something around $600 called leather is inordinate, given the price of cow hides and the number required to cover a couch.

It all just doesn't compute, does it?

I suppose a genuine hide is processed! ???

Doyle

[scott_san_diego]

The one that gets me is, the couch is 100% leather.  But the only thing that might be leather would be the faces of a couch.  Top of the seat, back, arm and everything else is vinyl.  And they are selling it for $699.00

Scott

[sofadoc]

At least once a week, I get a call from a customer that goes something like this:

Customer: I have a leather sofa.
Me: Is it genuine leather?
Customer: Yes......uh.....well, it's supposed to be.
Me: Do you remember approximately what you paid for it?
Customer: Around $600.

Furniture store salesmen have a crafty way of glossing over the fact that it isn't leather at all.
Many times, it's actually the customer who refers to it as leather, and the salesman just doesn't bother to correct them.

But I'm not a big fan of genuine leather anyway. I just don't think that it's worth what it costs. In many cases, it doesn't really last that much longer than processed imitations. And since it costs a ton more, I don't really think that it's a good value. Leather is just a "status" thing.

[SHHR]

I get this a lot on auto/truck seats. A customer brings in a vehicle with leather for repair on the driver seat bolster that's worn out from entering/exiting frequently. I get out my vinyl samples to match grain and color and they have a fit saying how they need it back in leather. They then are shocked when I show them through the ripped material that only the face is leather, but the sides are matching vinyl. Then they get the price and lead time difference on replacing a 4" X 18" leather piece with a high quality vinyl that no one will ever know has been changed. Vinyl almost always wins out.
Kyle

[byhammerandhand]

There's leather and then there's leather.

There is some stuff called "bonded" or "rebonded" or whatever leather that is so a hide what particle board is to lumber.   Chopped up scraps blended in resins and pressed into a sheet.  I've heard some of this stuff is durable, what what I've seen (low end furniture) it's not.  Seams will rip open, color will wear off, and other sorts of damage.

There's also what is commonly called "leather match" meaning the parts you touch (inside arms and inside back) are hide and what you don't touch is vinyl.  I've even heard of dodgy sales people who will put their hand on the inside back and talk about "this is top grain leather in this chair"  (the implication being the part he's touching).


But you want to see some real misleading names, try getting into the wood finishing world, where there is absolutely no relation to advertising and labels to the contents some times.

[SHHR]

There's leather and then there's leather.

There is some stuff called "bonded" or "rebonded" or whatever leather that is so a hide what particle board is to lumber.   Chopped up scraps blended in resins and pressed into a sheet.  I've heard some of this stuff is durable, what what I've seen (low end furniture) it's not.  Seams will rip open, color will wear off, and other sorts of damage.

There's also what is commonly called "leather match" meaning the parts you touch (inside arms and inside back) are hide and what you don't touch is vinyl.  I've even heard of dodgy sales people who will put their hand on the inside back and talk about "this is top grain leather in this chair"  (the implication being the part he's touching).


But you want to see some real misleading names, try getting into the wood finishing world, where there is absolutely no relation to advertising and labels to the contents some times.

There use to be a factory in town that did this. When I was a teen I worked as a delivery driver at an auto parts/industrial supply store and they were on our account, so I was in there often delivering items. They took fresh hides and washed, tanned, then chopped up everything and processed it into bonded leather products. Some items I saw in the office once were higher end flooring squares for kitchens and baths. They advertised it would hold up better than vinyl, but I have no idea how well. The economy a few years ago got the when it was discovered the owner wasn't paying property taxes. The state took the factory away and tried to run it themselves and that lasted less than 6 months when they drove it in the groud the rest of the way. The one thing I do remember about the place was it stunk to high heaven inside from processing the hides.

[baileyuph]

It must be a generational thing, not only do they call vinyl leather, they come in my shop and want something "wrapped" in a material, leather as one example.  I am looking at the item and there are seams everywhere to achieve  fit and in my mind, "they think all you do is JUST wrap!

It is easy for me to offend, because I ask you want this (the seamed covering on something) wrapped?  I say like a Christmas present?  Then, they might say something like what ever you do? 

I never realized how vague cutting, fitting, and sewing can be to some people.

The other one I get, covers, upholstery, even sophisticated uphostery may be referred to as skins.  Skins equate to upholstery?

::)

Doyle

[MinUph]

I've always been amazed with the fact that people have no idea what it takes to do anything unless of course it is their livelihood. From Upholstery to remodeling its all the same. The terms they use reflect this and are quite understandable from their point of view. We take a chair and if we are good at what we do we make and install a skin for the chair. We fit, cut, sew and wrap a chair also. It is only terms used by non trades people to explain what they think they want.

[sofadoc]

I think some customers like to use the term "wrap" because it just sounds so much cheaper.

[Mojo]

Imagine doing a seminar on motorcoach care and standing in front of 30 - 50 people who spent 1/2 a million dollars on their bus and telling them " Folks, those cockpit seats you have and those couches and chairs, they are vinyl not leather ". They look at me like I have two heads.

They tag them with clever names like Leatherete, leathermate, etc. but they are vinyl. I had one of the owners come up to me after my seminar and tell me I was full of shi* that his were leather for sure. I told him the fastest way to find out is flip the skirt over and see if the backside is made of fabric. He came back later that day to tell me " you were right, they are vinyl ". Really ??? Imagine that.

Now the $ 1.5 and 2 million dollar buses do have leather. High quality leather and sometimes exotic leathers. I have seen some cockpit seats with cowhide bolsters and the center inserts were ostrich or gator hides. But if the bus cost under a million new, chances are they are vinyl. When people discover they have been buying expensive leather treatments to treat their " vinyl " they typically are not very happy. I tell them " Buy Aerospace 303 and use that and call it good ".

I had an older couple stop by and have me look at a seat cushion for their couch at their house. It was a job I was planning on throwing at Paul since I do not do furniture. I told them it was bonded leather, cheap and they would need to get the fabric from the factory. It had a fabric back and the strands and bits of what little leather was on it was peeling off. Guess what ?? The manufacturer went out of business. No way to get matching fabric.

These furniture store people should all be taken out back and shot for false advertising. They remind me of used car salesmen. Lying, BS'ing jerks.

Chris

[JDUpholstery]

I just redid a leather seat for a Chevy Silverado SS...the customer looked offended when I broke out my vinyl samples to match it up with...after showing him how much vinyl there was in his seat he requested that I do the entire seat with leather...I did the calculations and decided that I could do everything except the back of the backrest with 1/2 hide...told him if I had to order a full hide just to do the back of the seat it would cost him a 130 bucks more, so he agreed to let me do that with a matching vinyl...which it was originally...

[kodydog]

Just did an in store, bonded leather repair. The delivery guys forced it through the door and scratched the arm panel and seat front. After inspecting it I couldn't help but notice the damage would only have been a surface scratch and even repairable had it been real leather. The store owner even said, I don't see how they can call this stuff leather.

[baileyuph]

How was it repaired?  Or was the scuffed areas replaced?

[kodydog]

I replaced the arm panel at the store. While we had it on its back the store owner noticed the scratch continued along the seat front. I believe had the seat front been real leather the scratch would have disappeared with a good leather conditioner. Just like I've done in my shop so many times before. But because the top layer is really vinyl the scratch has a washboard effect, making it beyond my skills to repair.

[JDUpholstery]

I was approached to fix something similar today Kody, The scratch is on the back panel, they want to know if I can just dye it so it is not as apparent...I told them I would go look at it later this week and see just how bad it is, since pictures do not tell the whole story