dealing with customers

[gene]

Today I told a long time customer to take their business someplace else.

I think what they did was, instead of approaching a problem in a mature, reasonable, professional manner, they felt they could manipulate and intimidate me because they "owned me" due to the business they were bringing me.

After our first meeting on this issue they ended the discussion by saying, "You can decide how happy you want to make me."

I have always appreciated their business but they have always been a source of stress and sometimes anxiety for me.

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My evaluation on this option to cut bait:

How will this effect my sales? Definite dip in sales dollars but I believe I will quickly/eventually make it up with new business.

How will this effect my business' reputation? Neutral to positive. (Positive if others have had similar issues and hear about this.)

How will this effect the kind of business I want to have? Very positive.

How will this effect me personally? Very positive. I am grateful I did not NEED to bend over and take it. Less stress. Less anxiety. I think I will be a bit more relaxed overall. Integrity intact.
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In a very real sense this is a lose/lose situation, and I feel bad about this. This is not the kind of results I want to have.

And to answer Rodney King's question, no we all just can't get along.
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I am going to look closely at how I manage my business in terms of my customers. I'm not sitting in an office waiting for the next customer to come in. I am reupholstering, cleaning, making phone calls, getting tired, feeling irritated, buying supplies, doing paper work, wondering where I put my scissors, when the next customer comes in.

Could I have managed my business better, with this customer over the years so we would not have gotten to this place? I'm thinking probably not, but I will take a look at this issue anyway.

I hope some of this might be helpful to others.

gene

[MinUph]

Gene,
  I think we all experience something like this at least once. I did and when I ended the relationship it was a major relief for me and my people. It wasn't a big customer but a high maintenance one put it nicely.
  You will over come. The fact that you concerned yourself enough to think about it this much and pass it on shows you didn't act on the spur of the moment. I tend to do that and it is not good for either parties.
 

[sofadoc]

I've never had a formal parting of ways with a customer. There have been some that went away because they sensed my lack of enthusiasm for doing their work. Sometimes, I made up any excuse necessary to discourage them.

But I've noticed over the years that for every customer that I lose, a new one has always taken their place.

Every time my residential work dries up, the commercial jobs start rolling in. And vice-versa.

My theory is..........as long as I have a backlog, I don't worry about it.

If I sense that a customer expects me to grovel at their feet, it's an immediate deal breaker.

[Rich]

My theory is..........as long as I have a backlog, I don't worry about it.

Aye, there's the rub! What to do when you DO need the work?
For me, I trust that God will see me through even if it hurts in the short term.
He always has.
Rich

[SteveA]

You run your business like most of us.  You are involved in almost everything.  Therefore you know what's best for your company even though they can catch you on a bad day.  Working with your hands puts a different spin on how you deal with clients. Your mindset and success is not to entertain customers - it's to get the work done and make sure everything else runs smoothly.
If you worked for somebody and they had several folks who dealt with customer service and sales you would have never had the dust up with this client.
I look at it this way - if a particular client can't recognize the wisdom and quality of the person they are using then the problem is there's alone.
Common sense should tell a seasoned client when to back off from pushing a craftsman's buttons when they have a house who can more than do the right job time and time again.
That long time customer will show up again and you decide if you want them back.
SA

[kodydog]

We worked for a designer who split her upholstery work between us and another upholsterer who charged less money. She sent to us all the difficult jobs he did not want to do . And whenever he screwed up she had us repair it. So we raised our prices, and we kept raising them to the point she stopped using us.

Last December we charged a designer $50 to measure a sofa and 2 chairs for slip covers. When she got the fabric for the sofa she asked if we could pre-shrink it. Her customer washes them often. We told her the fabric should be shrunk and resized by a professional. She said okay and even though we did two other jobs for her the slipcovers were never mentioned again. Last week she called and said the fabric for the chairs came in and shes ready to go. She said shes not going to worry about the shrinkage and we should just allow for it when we make our pattern. Rose told her there is no way to adjust the pattern for shrinkage because each fabric shrinks differently. Rose then pointed out the fabric's cleaning code is rated S, solvent only. Rose told her if the fabric isn't pre-shrunk before we start working with it we are not interested in doing the job. This didn't make the decorator happy and she proceeded to call rose every thing but the son of god. We have a pretty good feeling this job was going to come back to bite us in the butt.

Last week we did a $300 toss pillow job for a decorator. Yesterday she left a message saying when she got to the customers house they were all the wrong size. I'm pretty good with a ruler and she gave us a detailed list of sizes so I'm pretty sure we didn't mess them up. Only thing I can think is her idea and our idea of a 15" toss pillow must be different. But, she is a long time customer and has sent us many good jobs so were going to help her out.

Point is its not hard to tell who the good customers from the bad and the good ones you treat like gold. But The customers you never seem to make money on, I'd rather loose a customer and maybe have a slow period once in a while then keep accepting those money loosing jobs. That's no way to run a business.

[sofadoc]

We worked for a designer who split her upholstery work between us and another upholsterer who charged less money. She sent to us all the difficult jobs he did not want to do

I had one that did the same thing. The other guy got all the meaningful work, and all I got were his culls. The decorator was always using the promise of more work as a negotiating ploy.

I've had some mutual parting of ways without any harsh words being said. And usually, they come crawling back after they've worn out their welcome everywhere else. It's kinda like marriage. Some people have to go through a divorce or two before they mellow out and learn that the sun doesn't rise and set in their ass.

[baileyuph]

Today, one of my long time customers called me to go look at their sofa to estimate yardage, she and her designer needed to order.  In the past, I furnished the fabric and there wasn't an ID involved.

The customer "is not" ordering the fabric from me and expects me to spend travel time plus vehicle expense to provide the yardage requirement - without compensation.

That arrangement is against my grain - because it is a time give away.

I have a back log of work, it isn't like I need the job --

Some people and their designers just don't understand business and time management.


So, at that point, of course I balked. 

We business people can't give that time away can we??

Designers !!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't get me involved!  It would be interesting to  hear their line with a customer.  The drift I get is they may only be color/pattern matchers.

This is just one advantage of doing auto/marine/ and a lot of the other work.  Designers or color matchers don't enter the picture nor does the shop owner run to their houses for free.


Doyle

[sofadoc]

This thread causes me to dredge up in my mind that tired old topic "Difference between a decorator and a designer".

I don't know anyone that still goes by the title of decorator. They all prefer to call themselves designers because it sounds fancier, and they feel like they can charge more for their services.

But what exactly defines a designer?

One isn't a designer simply because they can pick out fabric (after all, thousands of housewives do that every day).
One isn't a designer because they know how to run to JoAnns and buy mass marketed fabric (again, housewives do that too).
And finally, does calling an upholsterer out to the customer's home in order to do the estimating for them make one a designer? Housewives also know how to dial a phone number.

You might argue that housewives often make poor choices that are impractical or downright unreasonable. Well, so do designers.

[MinUph]

First Doyle,
  You should be compensated for your time. I will do a yardage and labor estimate over email but will charge for a in house estimate for a Decorator.

Secondly to hope on Dennis' remark. A decorator is someones wife that can decorate something better or at least supposedly better than a customer. A designer is a trained person who not only can decorate like a customer but has schooling in the design aspect of whatever they are designing. A professional that is.
On a lighter note. I will work with either if they 1. are nice, 2. pay me for my services, and 3. give me what I need to do my work.

[gene]

You should be compensated for your time.

A few days ago I gave a price to a new customer for pick up and delivery of their furniture. They thought that was rather expensive. (Expensive compared to what? The cost of a loaf of bread?)

Hey, I might start saying that. When someone complains about my prices, I think I will say, "Yes, it is more expensive than a loaf of bread."  :)

I told them that my heating and air conditioning guy charged $95 dollars just to pull into my driveway at home. He starts charging more once he gets out of his truck.

If I don't value my time, neither will my customers.

The "hook" for small business owners is that we need business to survive. If we are slow, it is very tempting to do what it takes to get any business in, including lowering prices and not valuing our time.

In another post kodyD mentioned using a volunteer from SCORE. I believe he is the only other person on this forum (other than me) to mention using SCORE. The one big message SCORE has for small business owners is DO NOT COMPETE ON PRICE. I think these guys and gals mention this so much is because it is so easy to do and yet so detrimental to business success.

And thank you for your replies on my OP. I do appreciate being able to toss out my experiences and get helpful, positive feedback in return.

gene

[RiCat]

The "hook" for small business owners is that we need business to survive. If we are slow, it is very tempting to do what it takes to get any business in, including lowering prices and not valuing our time.

When slow and a lower price is given to try to get work in, the customer could say, "let me think about it". Then things pick up, shop gets busy, and then the customer that was given the lower price returns (within a reasonable amount of time - like 30 days) with the work and the lower price. Price has to be honored while other more profitable work is at hand. I had a owner of a repair shop share this with me many years ago. He would not give the lower prices when slow. It is a difficult discipline to develop. 

Rick

[MinUph]

I had a owner of a repair shop share this with me many years ago. He would not give the lower prices when slow. It is a difficult discipline to develop. 

Rick

Once adopted it is no longer hard to have the discipline to follow through with this. The idea of lowering prices to bring work into a slow shop is part of the reason why this and other trades become less profitable and quality is lowered in the end.

[brmax]

I hope with some copying and tablet builds for tear-off forms possibly. That another of my new papers I been working on last week can be used shortly, its almost finished.

Like the other form I need to do some work with locking the spaces or protect the selected cells thing, anyway its  "a proposal form" and I am using a 30 day estimate.
I think this amount of decision time is plenty adequate.

During this time frame the customer can sign on for further material agreements and thereby starting further commitment and not allowed to cancel the job after the materials are ordered.
I understand there can be other issues in this style and that would have to be dealt with as well.

It's a start for me here with additions from previous and I think by putting this in the form and "easily seen" it precludes some undesirable conversations. hopefully

Now the over the phone tire kickers with no pics, don't get me started : )

Good day
Floyd

[sofadoc]

The idea of lowering prices to bring work into a slow shop is part of the reason why this and other trades become less profitable and quality is lowered in the end.

I agree. When you lower your price even temporarily, that new price has a way of becoming the new norm.

It actually makes more sense to RAISE your prices during slow periods.