Another decorator story

[sofadoc]

I had one call me today from the Dallas area. She says that she's been in business for 36 years.
And yes, she referred to herself as a "decorator"...... not a "designer".

She started asking prices. Before I could even finish my sentences, she was already balking. She wanted a volume discount for all the potential work that she might send me. I told her that since I have more work than I can do now, there really is no incentive for me to give discounts.

The more she talked, the more I started thinking to myself "If she's been in business for 36 years and just now calling me, that means that somewhere in Dallas there's an upholsterer (or 2...or 3) who's sick of putting up with her". So I asked her for references. She was flabbergasted that I wanted references from HER. But frankly, I want to know why she's changing upholsterers. Did she fire them? Or did they fire her? If she's a PITA, I want to know before I waste any time with her.

There was a time in my younger days when I would've kissed her butt up one side and down the other. I love being a crotchety old fart! 

[hdflame]

I LOVE that little story!  So, did she offer any references?

[fingers]

I like your angle Sofa

[DBR1957]

Asking for references is very appropriate since she claims she will be giving you a lot of work.
You need to find out how much volume she does and over what time frame to calculate her
"discount".

I've heard it too from boat owner's. "Can you give me a better price? I'm going to be sending
a lot of work your way". Ummmm, I wouldn't be here if there wasn't sufficient work. 

[gene]

"If you take this money losing job I will promise to give you even more money losing jobs!!!"

I always ask why they are coming to me. Two last year got tired of their upholsterer smoking. I have had two new designers this year who got my name from current customers.

I did one small job for a new lady this year who said she was a designer. She is a friend of a long time designer customer of mine.

The first time she visited my studio and I showed her pictures of my work, she said "Oh, I can keep you busy." I took that as a BS line - RED FLAG. I haven't heard from her since January and I found out that she works in a furniture store as a sales person.

She said she would send me her sales tax exempt number and never has. This, I hope, will be the last time I do not charge sales tax without a tax exempt number. I gave this lady a 6.5% discount by trusting her.

When she picked up her chair, she wrote me a check, asked me the date which I told her, and then she put the next day's date on it. I didn't notice that until after she left.

I was taught, and I taught my sales reps, (when I was selling industrial paper packaging materials) to never take an order on your first sales call visit. You need to find out why they are so eager to do business with you, and it will most likely not be a good reason.


gene

[sofadoc]

So, did she offer any references?

Oh yeah, I forgot to finish that part. She said that she didn't give out her clients names and phone numbers "out of respect for their privacy".
I told her that I wasn't interested in talking to her clients. I wanted references from the other upholsterers that she dealt with.  She was doubly flabbergasted  :o

She never gave me any. She changed the subject just long enough to wrap up our conversation. I sensed that she would've only considered using me if I was cheaper than her current guy (which judging from her gasping sounds after hearing my prices, I wasn't).

[gene]

Requiring references sofadoc is a great idea. That would certainly help to create the impression of exclusivity. Sort of like calling your shop a 'studio' instead of a 'shop'.

I may have shared this before: That gasping sound you heard from that designer is called the 'flinch'. I was taught that in sales training. I always got a hotel discount with my library card. While traveling on business, I would stop in a nicer hotel. I would ask if they had a room and what was the rate. When they told me the rate, I would make a small 'gasp'. That's all. I didn't say anything. I just inhaled hard enough for it to be heard. Always!!! the hotel clerk would start trying  to find me a discount. Always!!!

Are you a member of our hotel club? No
Do you have AAA? No
Do you have AARP? No
I would say, "I do have a library card!" They would laugh and give me one of the above mentioned discounts. AND I DID NOT ASK FOR A DISCOUNT!

Thanks for the chuckle, sofadoc.

gene

[kodydog]

We went through a similar thing with a restaurant owner last November. He had two "banquettes" he needed done with the promise of more work later. He needed everything cheep and done overnight and by Christmas. It took us a month to set up an appointment to meet him (Hes a very busy man). Like I'm not. He said come in and we will discuss it over a glass of wine.

So we show up for the scheduled appointment but apparently the guy either doesn't know how to wright or never checks hes appointment book because the bartender said he was at his nieces graduation and wouldn't be in till later. (gee, can I still get my glass of wine).

We looked at the banquettes. On the phone he said these were very special pieces he bought out of a historic hotel in Miami. What ever!

The next day we gave him the quote and his response was, are you sure you can't do any better? He said, I'm expanding the restaurant and have a warehouse full of furniture.

Like Gene said, "If you take this money losing job I will promise to give you even more money losing jobs!!!" I love that.

We didn't get the job, life gets tedious don't it (Doc Watson)

[sofadoc]

We would ALL be retired by now if we could just cash all of those "Promise of more work later" checks.

[Ihavenoname]

Great topic and 5 gold stars for not taking any guff from people.  

And, thank you so much for the idea, I love the asking for referrals so much I mad a sign for my shop next to the phone. "Yes, I can give a discount to a designer/ decorator, but I'll need referrals from your venders and or other upholstery shops thank you.

In keeping in the sprite of discounting, my motto is, "If you can't offered it, then you simply just can't have one." It's just that simple.

That is, you can't have me do it.

Sure the guy with 1 years upholstery training will do it for less.
Or
You can buy a junky $300 sofa new
But
I don't care, Pay me or forget it. If price is all that matters then I'm not for you. Sorry.

It took me a long time to build up that philosophy and the back bone to say it, but I don't regret it. I actually wish I had done it years earlier.

Why just the other day I was remembering a guy I did a lot of Airplane work for. One time he got very upset that I was not working on his project exclusively as if I was just sitting around waiting for him to call. When I explained that I had other jobs already in the works before he called, he commented that he did not like to hear that, and wanted to know that he was my main focus. I basically told him there was nothing I could do. I was already working on the projects and had dead lines to meet.

For one he always wanted a good price. and two as soon as someone cheaper came along I was gone. In short we don't work together anymore.

Thinking back at it what I should have told him was that what he wanted was a full time employee. With that then they can focus 100% on his work all day and all night.

Point is yes stick to your guns and don't take crap from anyone. If they want it they have to pay for it. I want a new Lexus but ... I don't got the cash. So none for me.

Anyway, thanks for the ideas and I'll use it and add it to my bag of tricks.


PS I did do this but know the guy who was working for the designer. So I called him and asked why they were looking for a new upholsterer. He said that they got in an argument over price and he was looking for someone cheaper.  I called them back and said no to the work. My friend kept his work and his  pay.

[byhammerandhand]

would it be rude to laugh out loud, then cover your mouth and say, "Oh, you meant that seriously?"

We would ALL be retired by now if we could just cash all of those "Promise of more work later" checks.

[bobbin]

I always ask, "how did you get my name?".  9 times out of 10 the new customer is a friend of someone I know or have worked for in the past. 

I think asking any professional who's planning to use you as subcontractor for references is a really good idea.  Just because we're on the production end of the designer/decorator's service doesn't mean that we can afford to work for less, "just because".  The grim reality is that my fixed expenses remain the same regardless of who's going to be billed.   I figure it's probably the same of all the rest of our faithful readers. 

"One rate fits all", baby!  If I'm offered a job that is strictly a production thing (read: "from the neck down", crank it out at the sewing machine) I'll offer a piece rate.  But the only reason I'll offer that is because I have full function machinery and I know how to price by the piece.  NO way would I offer such a deal on "one of a kind" work. 

My days of toiling for grunt wages are long since gone.  If someone doesn't like my price then they can "run along" and pester the next person.  Me? I'll finish the work I have pending, or take that fool dog for a walk and play some ball, or weed the garden, you get the idea. 

Good move, Sofa.!

[fingers]

 I've seen good times and bad. Down here in my part of Fla business can be seasonal. I can see the sense in having a couple of good designers to work "with" IF they can help fill the lean times. A mutually beneficial relationship does not mean working for less money. A competent and experienced designer should be able to pretty much set their own price with their customer. After all, they are even more of a luxury service than a qualified custom upholsterer.
I think every designer should be able to est. yardage on a pc a furniture. If they can't do that, I ain't to keen on teachin' them. A good initial test.