JUKI LU-563 driving me insane

[njpatriot]

 I have already posted this on the welcome forum and it was suggested that I post it here, so here we go.  I have had my Juki LU-563 brought in for service to have this same problem fixed many times.  I constantly have problems with my bobbin thread knotting or not catching on the needle.  There is always an issue with this machine.  It had it serviced in October and I just got to using it and It knotted up again.  I have attached a video of what one of the problems is, can anyone explain how to fix this if it is possible?  I have put a lot of money into this machine and I am on the verge of tossing it out.  I have never had the chance to sew anything on this machine, maybe it is not worth keeping around.  Any suggestions?   I am sure that it is operator error but I do not know what I am doing wrong.  I hold the needle thread tight and the bobbin thread tight as I start which is what I was instructed to do by the person that sold me the machine. 

youtube video options:

http://youtu.be/09rfpRGgZ4U

juki lu-563 problem 001.MOV

[Toledo Mach. Sales]

You must have it threaded wrong,when you put the foot down is there alot of tension on the thread?
Bob

[njpatriot]

Yes there is a lot of tension where I am holding onto it.  The little foot that the needle goes through closes on the threat that I am holding.  I am not sure how to thread it otherwise.  Thank you for your response. 

[bobbin]

Do you have an operator's manual and parts book for the machine? one of those will give you the proper threading pattern for both the top thread as well as the bobbin thread, the other the helpful exploded views of the various assemblies of the machine.

I had a  562 (small bobbin version of your machine) for many years.  It was a nice machine, but personally I find the model a bit quirky and persnickety about starting to stitch.  You have to hold the top and bobbin thread securely when you begin sewing or you'll end up with a big bird nest of snarled thread on the underside of the work.  Very important to remember that! big snarls can trip the safety clutch and leave you with a bobbin case that spins although the needle bar will not go up and down.  This is a safety feature to keep the machine from getting damaged by forcing it.  If that snarled thread thing happens repeatedly there is the liklihood that some of the thread has wound around and gotten jammed under the bobbin case, and this makes everything sieze up.  You then have to remove the throat plate, the feed dog, and lift the bobbin case out to remove the (usually tiny piece) of thread under the bobbin case.  

Caution:  put the tiny screws on a piece of paper towel where they won't hit the floor or end up the oil pan (ask me how I learned this).  Pay good attention to how things look before and as you disassemble the mechanisms (use your digital camera!).  It is important to pay attention to that because you have to get it all back together in the precise order and alignment to get the machine to work properly.  I know you are frustrated but this is a nice machine and with some help you will quickly master it.  

[njpatriot]

Bobbin, thank you for the encouragement!  I had that exact "birds nest" under the material that I was attempting to sew.  This is when there was additional thread knotted up under the plate where the bobbin is.  I must have tripped that safety clutch that you mention.  I have a poor copy of the owners manual.  My copy does not clearly show if the needle is threaded above the walking foot or if the walking foot is threaded followed by the needle after if passes through the walking foot.  I am saying walking foot, I am under the understanding that the foot that the needle goes through is the walking foot.  I love to have a copy of a repair manual to fix minor problems with this machine, but I have not been able to find one.  Thank you again. 

[bobbin]

All threading of any machine is done when the needle is in its highest position in the cycle.  For you, this means that you will pass the thread through the eye of the needle (from left to right) when the needle can go no higher.  Once the thread is through the eye of the needle rotate the hand wheel slowly and watch the needle descend and the hook pass by.  A loop will be formed and you want to pull the bobbin thread up through the hole in the throat plate so that both threads are under the presser feet.  The needle thread will then be through the hole in the centre foot.  Make sense?

This is one of the "persnickety" details that annoyed me about the 562 and the 563.  It's fiddly and if you don't follow the protocol you will find yourself in "a world of hurt".  Now that both threads are where they ought to be make sure you hold onto them "on take off" or the snarled, bird nest thing is sure to follow.  I certainly hope this helps you. 

Do yourself a favor and split some leather to buy a good copy of the both the operator's manual and the parts book.  They are invaluable and worth every dime.  Most times you can get them for zippo, too!

[sofadoc]

I'm with Bobbin's theory about a knot of thread UNDER the bobbin case. Did you remove the 3 tiny screws that she mentioned, and lift the bobbin case out of the hook assembly? That's where the knot would be at.
The thread goes through the eye of the needle, and THAT'S IT. It doesn't go through the welt foot hole (although that probably isn't causing the problem).
Did the service center offer any advice as to why this problem reoccurs?
Do you have new needles? What gauge? What size/type thread?

[JuneC]

What they all said...  Before pulling the hook out, though, flip the machine up and see if you can see any obstruction from the underneath.  Maybe if you can grip the tail end of the thread with a pair of needle-nose pliers you can wiggle the bobbin back and forth and get it out without pulling the whole thing apart. 

I have two Singer versions of that same machine.  My first one gave me fits for ages and I couldn't figure out why.  Same symptom as yours.  Random birds nests under the throat plate.  It took me probably 2 months to figure out exactly what was happening.  You see that little square(ish) protrusion on the bobbin case?  When you put the plates back over the feed dogs (the metal parts with tractor treads) and screw it down, that little protrusion needs to be between the little upside-down "ears" on the bottom of the plate. 

Now what was happening with my Singer was that any amount of tension on the thread would cause the whole enchilada to spin.  It's not supposed to.  The hook spins, but the bobbin case is supposed to jiggle back and forth and that tab needs to stay pointed left, toward the needle.  Mine would flip out from under the plate, regardless of how tight I fastened the screws and the bobbin case would spin completely around, causing a thread mess.  I solved the problem by simply replacing the throat plate that goes under the needle.  The "ears" underneath had just worn down letting the case spin.  Hang in there.  I know how frustrating it can be.     

June

[sofadoc]

What they all said...  Before pulling the hook out, though, flip the machine up and see if you can see any obstruction from the underneath.

Just to be clear, I'm not suggesting pulling the hook. I'm just talking about taking the bobbin case out and checking to see if there's a ball of thread under it.
I'm assuming that when it comes back from the shop, the tab that June spoke of is correctly in the slot of the feed dog plate. If not, you REALLY need to find a new repairman.

[brownie2]

I'm sure if you ask here, someone will tell you about a knowledgeable service center.
From your video, it appears that the feed dog is moving fine. It may need adjusted up more.  It should be a full tooth above the throat plate.  The single adjustment screw is underneath the machine.  
You mention that the bobbin holder doesn't spin.  It shouldn't.  The hook assembly should spin as well as the bobbin.  That sword shaped hook should catch on that triangle piece and stop the bobbin case from spinning.  (correct me if I'm wrong folks, I'm new to the machine as well).
I also think you should check under the bobin case by removing those three TINY screws.
Manuals are easy to find with a web search.  I hear that some of the downloads for $ versions are not very clear with the pictures.  A photocopy version may be best.  If you contact Greg at Keystone, he may be gracious enough to provide you with a nice PDF version for no charge.  If he does, it would be nice to order some stuff from them like I did!  They are some really nice folks.
If your machine isn't sewing perfectly when you leave the service center, they're not worth using again.  They should at least be abler to tell you if the machine is completely wore out or how to operate it.
Look up a youtube video of how to thread a consew 226,225, or singer 111.  THere all the same pretty much and most parts are the same.

[njpatriot]

Thank you all for your assistance.  I removed the three tiny screws and removed the bobbin case to find a piece of thread underneath.  Once removed, I replaced the bobbin case and attempted to sew again.  I have another knot.  I had to walk away from the machine, I will attempt to clear the knot tomorrow.  I am going to review all of your suggestions again and see if I can clear this up.  Thanks again, I will keep all updated.

Jeff

[Mojo]

Jeff:

PM me your e-mail address and I will e-mail you a good PDF copy of the manual. It is the same one that I got from Greg.

Chris

[Mike8560]

I just wanted to say I've for a couple tools o have at the ready

1 is a broken seam ripper.  The ball broke off kea ing the poi Ty part I use it to help
pull up
my bobbin thread pulling the loop up. And pick grad out from the bob in and I r have a set of curved tip
hemostats. Like June said I. An grab a thread and wiggle thebwheel
forward and. Ack a n slip it out  without removing the case.  A tackle shop should have theese hemostats many guy like them flyfishibg. 

[sofadoc]

I removed the three tiny screws and removed the bobbin case to find a piece of thread underneath.  Once removed, I replaced the bobbin case and attempted to sew again.  I have another knot.

After removing the thread from under the bobbin case, did that at least take away the "rough spot" when turning the wheel by hand?
Try holding both threads off to the right, and rotate the wheel by hand until the threaded needle goes down into the fabric. Maybe even manually sew a few stitches. After doing this, does it still knot up when you sew by motor?
As others have stated, that model is cantankerous when it comes to starting off.
My Grandmother sewed on old Singers for 40 years. When she would try to sew on my Lu-562, it would take her exactly one nanteenth of a second to get it in a tangled up mess. It was strictly operator error. 

[njpatriot]

I am trying to clean up my last knot so I will post two videos of me attempting to load the bobbin and me attempting to sew.  This may help to explain my problem.  I will next attempt to try to sew my first few stitches by hand when I clear the machine up.  I will get back to this tomorrow, have to walk away from the machine again.

Juki LU-563 problem 1.MOV

http://youtu.be/IHfr6dIHOoI

Juki LU-563 problem 2.MOV

http://youtu.be/SuJzDkPuZYw