Close to the epicenter

[gene]

I keep thinking I'm the smartest person on this forum but folks keep proving me wrong. This time it's kodydog.  :)

Here's a link to a blog that I enjoy reading. This guy is an historical scholar. Not everyone on the forum will appreciate what he has to say. His last post is along the lines of what we are talking about here: what are the factors that keep poor people poor.

His post is a bit wordy.

My reply is the 6th reply. It's signed "Gene the upholsterer."


Nietzsche versus the Nanny State

http://www.robertmprice.mindvendor.com/zblog/

gene

[Virgs Sew n Sew]

Please remember that the Interstate Road System that we know today began under President Eisenhower's tenure and was his baby, thus the reason that you see markers on some of the Interstate system that has Eisenhower's name on it.  Forget exactly what it says as it has been close to 10 years since I've been on the Interstate.  The roads are maintained through tax dollars which is as it should be.  God forbid that they become privatized and we have to start paying for the privilege of driving on these roads.  My last boss is a real anti big government type of guy.  Funny thing is that he owns a fire sprinkler business.  Government regulations caused his business to explode and thrive as it is today.  Without government regulations, NFS would have folded years ago.  His trucks go pretty much all over the State of Nebraska and would be in terrible shape if government tax dollars didn't contribute to the upkeep of those roads.  He busts his @ss to keep his ss contributions as little as possible.  One year he spent close to 10K on lowering his tax burden and probably only lowered it by $500.00 or less.  He was all over getting his ss & medicare card as soon as he was eligible.  Hypocrisy at its finest.

I have no problem with b. owners making profit.  It was their "baby" and their blood, sweat & tears that built it but they also need to realize that their workers are helping to sustain it.  You can continue to make lots of money and pay your workers a decent wage.  What I see are billionaires that are milking every penny they can out of their business and workers who need food stamps to survive.  That is just crazy, IMO.  The same boss I referenced earlier took 1/4 M out of the Company each quarter (more if profits allowed it).  The last year I worked for the cheap bastages we did not get annual raises as "we couldn't afford it".  However, all three owners got brand spanking new pick-ups.  First of the year, they gave us a cola.  Office people got a whopping $0.25 per hour and the senior installers got $0.48 an hour and junior installers got $0.35.  Then the General Manager changed his salary from $900 a week to $1800 a week.  Construction Manager went from $900 a week to $1375 a week.  Obviously they could have given decent raises and were just too cheap too.  I took a permanent vacation from that place several weeks later.

Darren, how do we the people take control back.  People need to stop being apathetic and realize that their vote does count.  Vote the bums out.  I honestly think that there should be term limits -- like one term and you're gone.  Also, all the payoffs and money in the back pockets of our elected representatives have to stop.  If you look at net worth before and after terms, it wobbles the minds.  Big oil pads their pockets, insurance companies pad their pockets, the list goes on and on.  That should be illegal.  No elected representative should be allowed to take any money other than their salary ... period.  That would be a good start.  Perhaps then our elected representatives would do what the people that elected them want done not what big donors want done.

Virginia

[byhammerandhand]

Ditto.  +1   X2  :thumbsup:  or whatever the sign of agreement is here.

I keep thinking I'm the smartest person on this forum but folks keep proving me wrong. This time it's kodydog.  :)

[sofadoc]

I started this thread selfishly enough, worried that some knucklehead might throw a brick through my window.

But it has turned into a really thoughtful discussion. These are normally the kind of discussions where someone goes a little too far and things turn ugly.

Everyone has expressed some well thought-out opinions. And they've done it in a way that is respectful of one another.

KD says that we live in a country where everyone has the opportunity to rise from poverty. And I agree, they do. But I would say that for those who were born into 3rd, 4th, 5th generations of poverty, the odds are certainly stacked higher against them.

As for Madonna, I'm reminded of what Peter Jennings said when reporting about the death of Sonny Bono:
"He couldn't sing........he wasn't very funny.......and he didn't know much about politics. But somehow Sonny Bono succeeded at all three." 

[SteveA]

Peter Jennings - nice man - was working in his apt one day on 5th ave - sent there by a decorator.  He smoked a lot while I was there and I was thinking why would a guy with all he had hurt his own health. Human nature or the cause of others actions ?  Why won't people try harder or do they not care about themselves and need to on lean on someone like Sonny did with Cher.  Could Sonny make it alone ?   My Grandfather did.  Came here with nothing - is that not similar to already being here with nothing.  Didn't stop your grandparents or mine - I'm just saying.  Please don't break my window.
SA

[gene]

DON'T TASER ME BRO!!!

I can't remember the last time the KKK rioted - burned other people's cars, broke store front windows, looted anything that they could steal? Maybe they do it differently down in the Lone Star state.

The skin heads have been involved in robbing banks and such to finance their activities. Is there any difference between shaving your head and wearing a sheet?

These are normally the kind of discussions where someone goes a little too far and things turn ugly.

Sometimes I miss the good old ugly days when I was right and everyone else was wrong. I heard the phrase "I'd rather be happy than right." Turned my life around. I even get caught smiling on occasion.

gene

PS: Ignorance if not just when you don't know something. Ignorance is also when you choose to not know something. With the internet it is so easy to look up any facts that someone is purporting to be true. If someone's facts are not true, I tend to take that as a sign that they have made a choice.

[sofadoc]

These are normally the kind of discussions where someone goes a little too far and things turn ugly.

BTW  When I said that, I wasn't referring to anything that has ever been said by anyone on this forum. I was just talking about discussions of religion, race, and politics in general.

Another BTW  Peter Jennings was always my favorite news anchor. He had a soothing, reassuring voice that made you feel like everything would be OK (no matter how bad the news he was reporting was). And I never felt like he was forcing his own views down my throat.

[Rich]

He smoked a lot while I was there and I was thinking why would a guy with all he had hurt his own health...

We live at a time when we have access to more information than anyone in the history of the world and yet people still start smoking, eat high fat foods and run up their credit card debt. I've come to believe that we do what we want to do regardless of what we know to be true. That, incidentally probably explains another thing that was brought up here, that people raised poor generally don't improve their lot by much if at all. We tend to default to what feels most comfortable to us.
Rich

[kodydog]

At any rate, I'm sure that we're never going to agree under whose purvue social programs should be.  We just need to make sure that all people who need help get it.  
Virginia

I couldn't agree more. SS is slowly going broke. It is a huge drain on society. It needs to be reformed. There are too many people sucking off the government tit who truly don't need it. Their argument is, I paid into it and by god I'm going to get what I deserve. Unfortunately the lock box is gone. SS is nothing more than another tax. The current generation is paying for the last generation. The retired generation is the wealthiest group of people in our country. And they are also the largest voting block.  Let any politician suggest SS needs to be reformed and watch how fast he is booted out of office.

SS is a terrible investment. By the time I retire the return will only be .5%. The next generation will be 0 or negative investment.

Today's society only wants to know, what is the government going to do for me. A far cry from when JFK was president. I've heard many SS recipients state they use their SS benefits to take their next cruse or to buy their grand-kids handsome x-mas presents. They want what they can get with no regard to future generations.

I say vet those on SS. Only those who truly need it should receive it. This will probably exclude myself. But it has to start somewhere. As you all know self employed SS tax is double that of someone who is employed. I can't see paying SS taxes for the wealthy like Warren Buffett, Bill Gates, Dr Dre, Oprah, and, god forbid, my own mother who worked hard all her life and gets a sweet pension from the government.

And don't even get me started on emigrants or the tens of thousands of people on medical disability who are working "off the books" and receiving benefits. I can name a dozen acquaintances in this category.

[Rich]

Once again, a thoughtful, tell it like it is post on the wrong direction our country has taken in recent decades. We used to do what was right, now we do what feels good. Time to speak up and be heard.
You go Kody!
Rich

[SteveA]

KD
I don't think it is worth the trouble denying those their SS if they paid into it.  They worked for it - let them have it whether they need it or not.  Not our business how they spend their money - they worked for it.
Yes I pay both sides and it's a killer every quarter. How the gang in Washington manages our money is the problem not a payment to someone who worked for it. 
SA

[kodydog]

A must watch Robin Williams tribute to the flag,

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=336124543210366