Foreign Manufacturers

[baileyuph]

On an another slant, recent discussions have focused on how manufacturing differs and how to repair or fix the products imported in our country.  As a curious question, are all these foreign manufacturing facilities owned locally?  Does anyone know?  

The question is asked in a suspecious nature - just wondering if some are owned by any American companies who might have set up shop there to take advantage of cheap labor and lower taxes?

Probably not to a large degree, just thinking there might be some of that going on.

Doyle

[byhammerandhand]

It's my understanding that some US manufacturers have either set up their own facilities or contract with exclusive manufacturers.   Others go to a factory that makes, say, end tables, and order what they want from a catalog.  They might be the same as a dozen other labels, or there might be some minor differences.   Or the company may spec out an item and source it to "factory du jour."      If you ever Google parts for furniture, you could find pages of sources from Asia, for example, http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/upholstery-springs.html  In addition, there is no respect for intellectual property, so if a US design gets contracted at a factory, there's a chance they will start making knock-offs for someone else.  So yes, if you can imagine it, it probably happens. 


I had a job a couple of years ago where an end table was damaged beyond repair.   The company sent a new top for me to install.     I took out the drawer and took off the legs to move them to the new top.    Then I found

* The old legs had two bolts and holes to attach, the new top had one hole.   No problem, drill two new holes, add some hardware.

* The old drawer had a top guide; the new carcase had a bottom drawer glide.   I had to pull a bunch of parts off and throw them away, then move parts from old to new.

When I was done, the consumer asked about the pile of parts on the floor.   I had to explain why.

Other than that, they were identical.   So either they came from a different company that made the original, there was an undocumented engineering change since the original was made, got a deal on a pallet of drawer glides, or they found they could save 20 cents with the change.

[sofadoc]

There's a guy in my town who is always inventing little gadgets. Some of them require a little sewing. He always comes to me to sew a few prototypes. And he usually promises me that if the item goes on the market, he'll hire me to do the sewing part of the manufacturing.

Most of the time, I never hear anything else about whatever product it is. But occasionally, I'll see one of his inventions on a store shelf (usually some type of after-market auto interior gadget). They're on the shelf for a while, then they disappear.

Of the ones that DO make into the retail stores, they're always manufactured, packaged, and distributed from China. And yup, there's always an imitation "knock-off" that soon follows.

Japan rose from the ashes of 2 A-bombs into a world economic power. And they did it by ignoring US patents.
Now, China does the same thing.

[gene]

Japan's economy got hurt the same way as ours. They moved almost all of their mfg to China and China made products for Japan but also for themselves and were/are able to sell their own stuff cheaper around the world.

My first sewing machine is a Zoje. Juki had a plant in China making Juki sewing machines. This same plant took some of these sewing machines and put a Zoje name on them. I got one of these. The plant got caught and they started making Zoje in a different location. It's still a Juki knockoff just not off the exact same assembly line. My manual is identical to the Juki manual but has the name Zoje on it.

I have a friend who knows Chinese and was going to be sent to China to help start a plant there for a US mfg. He said the plans got nixed because China has made it very difficult for a foreign company to own a plant in China. China wants to own all their plants, it would seem.

gene

[Mojo]

I have alot of experience with China in regards to dealings and research for my previous clients. Also one of my very close friends is from Hunan, China and works on Wall Street. He has very deep business contacts in China and he was always my go to guy when clients came to me about manufacturing/product acquisition in China. He gave me one heck of an education on business practices in China and let me say they suck.

There are three ways to manufacture in China. 1.) Contract the production 2.) Build your own facility and make it yourself 3.) Go into manufacturing in a partnership ( the Chinese government is alot of times your partner ). Most companies contract it. Even Apple does this.

Most of my clients contracted manufacturers. They always had products that didn't require precision nor ruggedness nor did they hold patents. Typically after a year of manufacturing a certain part, another plant down the road would steal the idea, make contact with wholsalers in the USA and start making the same thing for the original companies competitors.

You can really get screwed there. One of my clients flew me to London for a meeting to discuss having their very unique product that all centered around safety and which also held a secret chemistry formula / treatment process making them the only supplier in Europe. They were looking to get their production costs down. I flew over, spent three weeks there touring, inspecting their plant and at the meeting asked them if they were all nuts. I told them NEVER allow that chemistry formula out of your hands or control. In the end I advised them to have the Italians manufacture the part and then bring it back to chemically treat it themselves. That they did. They command 80 % of the European market with this product. If it went to China it would have been the end of the company.

I was once offered a pretty lucrative business deal and part ownership in a magazine publication in China. I was all for it till I found out my partner was the government and they would own the majority of the company.

I should mention contractual law which I studied is bizzare in China. You bust your ass for 3 months and hammer out a contract and 6 months later they come back to the table, throw that contract out and want to negotiate a new one. Doing business in China takes a whole helluva lot of patience and/or Valium. They will drive you nucking futs.

Chris

[Mojo]

Doyle:

I forgot to mention the story about the Sailrite walking foot sewing machine ( I believe it is the LS1 ) which is basically a copy of the Thompson Mini Walker.

They contracted a Chinese factory to make it for them. 2 years later another factory down the street got the design and started manufacturing the same identical machine. They painted it a different color, rebadged it and then sent shipments of it to the USA. It was sold under the name Tuffsew on places like E-Bay ( I bought one ). Sailrite claimed it was not the same machine but many begged to differ as every single part inside the Tuffsew was interchangeable with the Sailrite model.

I can see how China has the financial power to build and modernize. They spend very little on R & D and instead steal intellectual properties, blueprints and designs from US manufacturers. It is almost a given that if you send a product to China for manufacturing it is as good as gone. If it is a high production piece they will copy it and manufacture it elsewhere under another brand name.

Entering China to do business is like entering hell and dealing directly with the devil.

Chris

[sofadoc]

It is almost a given that if you send a product to China for manufacturing it is as good as gone. If it is a high production piece they will copy it and manufacture it elsewhere under another brand name.

And if you DID find out that your product was being copied.........who you gonna complain to? The Chinese government? Good luck with that!

[Eric]

Yea, ask Mattel how it worked for them.