I hear that 5 or 6 times a year. My nearby competitor routinely quote prices on certain jobs that are almost half what I charge. BUT......he follows up that price quote with "But I'm too busy to get to it right now".
I suspect that he does this because he doesn't want the job, but on the other hand, he doesn't want anyone else to have it either. So he give a low-ball estimate, and then passes on the job. This way, he plants a seed of doubt in the customer's mind about having it done for substantially more money somewhere else.
I guess his strategy works a little. Because I get a lot of jaw drops when I quote prices, and then they tell me what "the other guy" was going to charge (had he accepted the job).
He only does this on oddball jobs that may end up being tedious. On "run of the mill" jobs, his prices are very similar to mine.
My policy on jobs that I would really prefer to pass on, is to pass without quoting a price. Some guys throw out a HUGE number just to get rid of the customer. I think this sends the wrong message. The customer then assumes that you are outrageous on everything. And that's what they tell everyone they know.
You get what you pay for
So his philosophy also includes, "IF I don't have anything else on the bench, I'll do it a bargain just to get the work."
Do you suggest that "That's a really good price. If you're happy with his quality, maybe you should have him do it," and see what their reaction is? Subtly planting the seeds of doubt in reverse.
Quote from: sofadoc on September 18, 2014, 06:46:58 am
I hear that 5 or 6 times a year. My nearby competitor routinely quote prices on certain jobs that are almost half what I charge. BUT......he follows up that price quote with "But I'm too busy to get to it right now".
Yeah! I could charge cheaper too, if I never got around to do it.
Quote from: sofadoc on September 18, 2014, 06:46:58 am
I suspect that he does this because he doesn't want the job, but on the other hand, he doesn't want anyone else to have it either. So he give a low-ball estimate, and then passes on the job. This way, he plants a seed of doubt in the customer's mind about having it done for substantially more money somewhere else.
He needs to be carful. The seed of doubt my be, he's a lot cheaper but what's his quality like?
Quote from: sofadoc on September 18, 2014, 06:46:58 am
My policy on jobs that I would really prefer to pass on, is to pass without quoting a price. Some guys throw out a HUGE number just to get rid of the customer. I think this sends the wrong message. The customer then assumes that you are outrageous on everything. And that's what they tell everyone they know.
Good point. The thing is you must be doing something right because you have plenty of business and don't need to play that game.
Quote from: byhammerandhand on September 18, 2014, 12:46:26 pm
So his philosophy also includes, "IF I don't have anything else on the bench, I'll do it a bargain just to get the work."
No, not really. He ONLY quotes low prices on jobs that he has absolutely NO intention of ever doing. Kinda like when a teenage girl dumps a boyfriend. She no longer wants him........but she doesn't want anyone else to have him either.
What's curious is that he does it routinely ?
Maybe he has a big turn over in help or plays games with guys salaries ?
SA
Quote from: SteveA on September 18, 2014, 02:16:28 pm
What's curious is that he does it routinely ?
Maybe he has a big turn over in help or plays games with guys salaries ?
He works alone. He only does it on jobs that he really doesn't want to do.
Perhaps I overstated when I used the word "routinely". But since I hear that feedback from customers several times a year, I assume it's only a random sampling of how many times he actually does it.
In an unscrupulous way, it really might be a brilliant strategy. People leave his shop thinking that he must be really good since he's too busy to do their work. And they tell everyone they know how reasonably priced he is.
QuoteBecause I get a lot of jaw drops when I quote prices, and then they tell me what "the other guy" was going to charge (had he accepted the job).
Here's a suggestion for the next jaw drop: "Wow! Yes mam (or sir). I understand. If I did it for that price I'd have to work so fast just to make a buck that you'd be bringing it back to me to fix what should have been done right the first time. No wonder that guy stays so busy." :o
gene
If I might add:
I got a call today. The lady told me what she wanted. I told her what I do. Without having talked anything about pricing, she said, "It sounds like to do really high quality work. Do you know an upholsterer in my area who does less quality? I don't think I need that good of a job."
And this after I spent 10 minutes of my day on the phone with her.
gene
I've told the story before about the upholsterer in town who takes the deposit for the fabric, orders it, and when the customer shows up asking when hes going to do the job he hands them the fabric and tells them to find someone else to do the job.
Drove by his shop the other day. The place is empty with a for rent sign out front.
Myself Dennis I would be honest with these customers and tell them outright that this is just a game this guy plays with you. I would let them know the truth and let his reputation drive him under.
I am very careful about bashing my competitors and to be honest I really do not have to. Our products and quality not to mention our customer service sell themselves. They can get any canvas guy to stitch up a slide topper or awning but does this guy know the assemblies ? Does he know the installation process ? Can he troubleshoot assembly and operations issues ? Does he know the OEM fabrics and colors ?
I have one competitor that drives me nuts. Everything I post on my website the guy copies and does with his own. He matches my techniques right down to the proper way to measure but the one thing he doesn't tell his customers is he uses substandard materials. He tries to mimmick our operation, sometimes word for word.
I had a customer place an order the other day for two slide toppers. They were a special model used in the late 90's / early 2000's. There are alot of them out there and they are tricky to sew and you only use acrylic fabric. This other company was trying to talk him into using their polyvinyl. It would have never worked and caused the customer nothing but headaches not to mention it would like crap.
I would just be upfront and honest with your customers and tell them the truth without bashing the guy to badly.
Chris
You can promote your business without ever mentioning the competition. We're getting ready to unveil our new web site. On it I point out services others around here don't offer. And some they do but I'm trying to get the reader to think we own these services. And try to use words like you instead of I. This and other info will be on a FAQ page.
WHY USE LADD UPHOLSTERY DESIGNS?
Courteous and professional service.
Convenience, our hours are 8am-6pm. We will also work around your schedule often making pick-ups, deliveries and estimates after hours and on weekends.
Customer's own fabric is gladly accepted and we can suggest outlets and online stores. This will give you unlimited styles and designs to choose from.
Your furniture is striped to the frame. We never cover over old fabric. No "short cuts" are ever taken. This is the only way to check the padding, springs and frame joints.
We are the only shop to guarantee our craftsmanship for the life of the furniture.
Your furniture is not picked up until we're ready to do it. But we will store your piece if needed. We work in a timely and organized fashion. Usually a two week turnaround from pick-up to delivery.
All work is performed by Ladd. We do not subcontract.
No furniture leaves the shop without Rose's seal of approval.
You will receive an estimate before we pick-up your piece.
This is a custom shop. We tailor your furniture to fit you.
Quote from: kodydog on September 19, 2014, 10:00:14 am
Your furniture is striped to the frame.
What if I don't want stripes on my frame? (insert smiley here).
BTW I agree. I never bad-mouth another upholsterer (even if their work or business practices are suspect). I think it sends the wrong message about the trade in general. I just keep my mouth shut when a customer mentions another shop. Sometimes they have had a disagreement with the other guy, and they want me to take their side. I won't.
One thing we differ on: While I will accept COM, I never say anything to encourage it. And I'm definitely not going to suggest any online stores, or outlets. I'm going to keep selling fabric as long as I can.
Stripped. Yeah that looks better. My spell check (wife) missed that one. 4 years of collage for what? When it comes to spelling or grammar I need all the help I can get.
QuoteNo furniture leaves the shop without Rose's seal of approval.
Who's Rose? I thought your wife's name was Mary. :o
QuoteCourteous and professional service.
Yes, even Guido, our 'late payment' collector, is courteous and professional. ;D
QuoteAll work is performed by Ladd. We do not subcontract.
How about: All work is performed by Ladd owners and employees. Except for Guido, who we pay piecemeal, by the broken bone.
QuoteYour furniture is not picked up until we're ready to do it.
Can customers drop off their own furniture to save a few bucks? Or is this understood and thus does not need to be mentioned?
Just trying to be helpful.
Great text, by the way, Kodydog. I'm looking forward to seeing your web site.
gene
College?
Quote from: kodydog on September 19, 2014, 02:55:13 pm
Stripped. Yeah that looks better. My spell check (wife) missed that one. 4 years of collage for what? When it comes to spelling or grammar I need all the help I can get.
Quote from: byhammerandhand on September 19, 2014, 04:00:26 pm
College?
Quote from: kodydog on September 19, 2014, 02:55:13 pm
Stripped. Yeah that looks better. My spell check (wife) missed that one. 4 years of collage for what? When it comes to spelling or grammar I need all the help I can get.
Maybe if you hadn't spent all your money on
collage you wouldn't be in this mess with a bunch of striped furniture frames.
With the right marketing those striped furniture frames are going to fly off the shelf. Then you'll be sorry.
Imagine my surprise when I got my first job at Chippendale's. I thought I was going to be a male striper.
If I was writing the job description it would have been "mail striper."
Having been in business a while now hearing -- "the other guys cheaper" is something almost from the past. There simply aren't as many doing any of what we on this board do. Fewer shops and people learning/practicing the trade.
What is note, however, is "I can buy new for a lot less". I do agree with that statement.
We, small shops, for most of the "complete redo work" cannot compete with most off shore products. Factory workers in one Asian enterprise pays $3 a day. Now, that is a much bigger issue than local competition.
Cost of living here is not equal to cost of living there..........
Things are a changing as we speak.
Doyle
Quote from: DB on September 20, 2014, 06:26:30 am
Having been in business a while now hearing -- "the other guys cheaper" is something almost from the past. There simply aren't as many doing any of what we on this board do. Fewer shops and people learning/practicing the trade.
I agree. It isn't something you hear much anymore. The only time I hear it around here, is when referring to the local guy who only QUOTES low prices (but has NO intention of actually doing any work for those prices).
But for customers who are shopping around for price comparisons, the pickin's are slim, and getting slimmer every year. Now, they ONLY compare against the cost of buying new. And that's a war that small shops are usually going to lose.
This is how my world spins:
If someone has an antique or a piece of furniture that has high sentimental value, they are usually looking for quality and service to get it reupholstered rather than only shopping for price.
With other furniture, I try to start with the people who have high end furniture to begin with. Then their question is to have it reupholstered or to buy new high end furniture. This provides for more reupholstery opportunities.
A rule of thumb was mentioned on this forum not too long ago: If they paid $1000 or more 10 or 20 years ago for their sofa, it's probably worth reupholstering today. Not a bad rule of thumb.
Anyone who bought a sofa for $600 5 years ago is not going to be interested in paying for reupholstering today. They are going to be looking at another $600 sofa.
gene
(https://forum.upholster.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1179.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx386%2FEdwinNorthuis%2Fth_FactoryMan.png&hash=bde6a1a0500cd0079ad6517865ba7816) (http://s1179.photobucket.com/user/EdwinNorthuis/media/FactoryMan.png.html)
Just finished this book about John Bassett III. Suggested reading by Mr Hammer. Anybody who is trying to figure just exactly what happened to our furniture industry should read this book. The author took three years to do her research. I thought it was very well written and factual. She interviewed hundreds of people and mentions many manufactures and furniture brands we all have worked on.
John Bassett split off from the furniture giant Bassett Furniture to take over the failing Vaughn Bassett Furniture. At the time of his departure Bassett Furniture had over 30 factories in the United States. Now they have none. John Bassett III decided to buck the system and keep his factories in the US. Its interesting How he managed and streamlined his business to be able to compete with China.
I found this while researching this review. Sure hope they portray him as a man who is dedicated to his business and employees and not one of a greedy CEO.
According to Deadline, HBO is developing the book as a miniseries. "Factory Man" is about a Virginia businessman, John Bassett III, who fought to keep the residents of Bassett, Va. (named after the business) employed rather than outsourcing work to foreign countries.
The possible miniseries is being produced by Tom Hanks and Gary Goetzman's company Playtone, which was also behind the HBO miniseries "John Adams" and "The Pacific," among others.