I've always done the sewing, not the pricing and I'm trying to start my own business in an area that would be specific to marine, and I don't know anyone else here doing it. Do you charge by the inch, or foot, or by the piece? Include vinyl costs and and shipping?
Florida Girl,
There really isn't a one-shot, quickie solution to pricing. It takes time and it takes attention to detail and some honest questions, too! But it's "do-able". There are a lot of things to consider before you hang out your shingle. So be patient. Read, ask, and "run the numbers". I had a fabulous professor in college (Retail Mg't.) and he always said, "any fool can turn a profit, it takes a merchant to hold onto it.".
I assume you're presently working for someone. You know how much you "take home".
1.) Is it enough to do all the things you need to get done (pay bills, SAVE for both future desires and RETIREMENT, and have some pocket money)? If not, how much more do you need to "take home" to do those things?
2.) You know how much you presently pay in taxes, it's on your pay stub. Now you need to know how much your employer pays on what you earn! you have to know that so you will be able to match the "take home pay" you presently earn (if it's enough) when you're the on the stick to the state and the feds.. This is incredibly important and it's where so many new business get tripped up... they haven't "run the numbers" and they don't know, and they get whacked with a huge "bill". You have to plan for this stuff, or you'll be totally porked! You do not want the state or feds on your case, so plan for the payments and just make them!
3.) How much will you have to pay for a work space? what will your utiliities run(on average) per month? (estimate high!). What will insurances cost? professional license fees? etc.? In combination with your wages/taxes, this figure will be your "overhead" and this is the figure that will allow you to determine the hourly rate you must charge customers to "break even".
Start crunching those numbers and when you've arrived at a numberthat reflects those "costs of doing business" you'll be ready to move on to pricing materials. But do the really basic stuff first. How do you eat an elephant? one bite at a time! There are so many very talented, experienced people on this board, but you have to really knuckle down and do the grunt work first. Check out SCORE and any basic adult education courses focussed on business. Read, read, and read more. Baby steps, but master them! it will make your life a whole lot easier in the final analysis.
Thanks for the reply, I've been self employed for over 20 years, and haven't drawn a paycheck as an employee for a long time. I own a small mobile home park, and do whatever I can to make a living.
Then since you're already well versed in the necessary taxes to be compliant and a good citizen of the USA, figuring mark-up and the necessary taxes on the items you wish to resell will be a breeze for you!
Once you're a legitimate and verifiable "business entity" (with all necessary tax numbers and licenses) you'll be able to establish credit with wholesale suppliers. After you've done that, you will know your materials cost and how much you will need/wish to mark it up before you bill your customer.
SCORE. Read, read, and read some more!
Thanks again! So do you charge by the square inch, or piece?
You have all the information you need.
Or, do a series of searches.
Fl G, sounds like you haven't stitched in quite a while. Might want to try getting a job working for a canvas shop and get your feet wet again.
I price by the piece, but I do furniture.
I'm in the middle of reupholstering a local gym, but charged by the square inch. There isn't a local canvas shop. Up coming is a pontoon boat, already done a jetski, have been working with a local fabric shop sewing pillows, etc. I like the marine stuff. I've worked for several sewing factories, jeans, Vanity Fair, and one making boat seats, worked for a bridal shop doing alterations, a taylor, and even a college theater department making costumes. Have done numerous Google searches, but not many, maybe one I've found that actually posts their prices.
florida girl,
This a question asked many times over. And never the reply your looking for. No-one can set a price for you. Each shop sets prices based on many factors. Overhead, supplies, labor, employees, rent, vehicle cost, many many more. You need to figure out what it costs you do do something and then you can figure the price. After adding all expenses, divided by time and adding in profit for you, and your business. This is true for any business.
hi Florida girl ditto what paul said, prices in my area arnt what one could charge in the palm beach area and i dont know about you neck of the woods. what i do is figure how much material i will need price wise and shipping, and figure my time to do the job. hours X my shop rate + material costs = job cost. ive got way to figure a job to make it easy figuring material at a specific price per yard to give a total ( this is easier with simple canvas covers) but not all jobs can be figured this way a simple snap on cover can take 8 yards and a harder console cover with a t top can take 8 yards but the 2 jobs may not be the same price nessarily
Thanks!
I agree with Paul and Mike. There's no magic potion for pricing.
In previous discussions, we've learned that there are as many different pricing strategies as there are stitchers. Some just charge a "lump sum", while others give an itemized invoice.
I wouldn't worry so much about "per inch". I would put more emphasis on charging adequately for time and materials.
Thanks!
The key I see with me is to be honest enough with yourself to know exactly how long each job will take, then charge by the hour or job. When I first got going I'd look at a simple seat and tell my self "that should only take 3 hours" then about 6 or 7 hours later when I'm wrapping up the project, I realize how much I actually gave away instead of earning.
Big manufacturing companies (especially those who practice JIT or lean manufacturing) constantly do studies to know how each minute or in your case Inches or feet cost, but for the small guy who's running a small one or two man shop would do well to work on getting the correct hours for estimating.
While I have many who want an upfront estimate many more just schedule a job and recieve the bill when finished. Those are the ones I enjoy because I can simply get the work done then add up my time and charge accordingly when finished. I always estimate on the high side anymore too, then if I come in under time I pass that on to the customers final bill and most always appreciate the savings.
Kyle
Thanks! I'm horrible at estimating time!
Quote from: SHHR on February 22, 2012, 05:42:27 am
"that should only take 3 hours" then about 6 or 7 hours later when I'm wrapping up the project, I realize how much I actually gave away instead of earning.
i wopnder also how many jobvs you would loose if the price was doubled
Until you're able to accurately estimate the time required to complete a given job you'll never be able to price accurately. There is a world if difference between the time actually required and the time "you think" it should take! I was shocked at the yardage required for a recent slipcover job, and was pleasantly surprised that my time estimate was right on the snapper.
I know how much money I have to charge/hr. to earn what I want to earn. That's number crunching and I told you how to do that (although you already knew how). I also know how much my supplies/notions cost and how much I wish to mark them up. All the rest is simply number crunching. No magic and definitely not easy.
Ya bobbin a criend santed vinyl to do to bucket sest for a boat tuck snd roll and a rear. Ench about 5' long tiluck n foll and two coaming pads 10' long. Y 25" tall i fitgured 17 yards He did the easy coaming pads
And started messing up the tuck n roll and called me sgsin to indid the teo cuckets and now have to do the bench back and bottom. Im resl low and may need more. I was surprised when i got 17 yards but its almost gone
I appreciate all your suggestions, I do keep in mind that I want to build a business, and need to be a little low, but I'm not doing it for nothing! Good news, is my gym job now wants me to cover his kitchen chairs! Still, the small pieces price out per inch too cheap, so I need particularly to raise those prices.
This is the hardest part for me, you want to sell the job but must make a profit too. I have two pontoon boats going right now, both get new carpet, recover all vinyl and custom covers. I bid them both at the same price, may lose money on one and do decent on the other. They are both the same length but one boat has much more vinyl with thicker bolsters and padding everywhere, while the other boat is rather plain and simple. Why I didn't catch this when estimating???? I am still learning this trade and learning comes at a cost from time to time.
Learning to price jobs is as much of an art as the work itself, sounds like you have much experience in the work part so your miles ahead of a lot of folks. One bit of advice would be to keep records of how much time and materials you have in each job and how much profit etc. You'll be able to look back at previous jobs for reference. Pay attention to details so you don't make a mistake as mentioned above.
Much success to you!
Keeping records of time is a good idea, need to remember this!
I would be leery of underpricing the market because as Kyle says, you will underestimate. I found this particularly true when I started out and had to figure out things or run out for parts and materials that I didn't have. Once you get into the swing of things, your efficiency will improve. Keep good records so you know that when you do this type of job, it has taken you X hours +-Y.
"Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment." -- Will Rogers
Quote from: SHHR on February 22, 2012, 05:42:27 am
The key I see with me is to be honest enough with yourself to know exactly how long each job will take, then charge by the hour or job. When I first got going I'd look at a simple seat and tell my self "that should only take 3 hours" then about 6 or 7 hours later when I'm wrapping up the project, I realize how much I actually gave away instead of earning.
I've been investigating what it costs to buy new, why reupholster if it's cheaper to buy new?
Quote from: florida girl on February 23, 2012, 11:03:08 am
I've been investigating what it costs to buy new, why reupholster if it's cheaper to buy new?
I can think of a few reasons:
- Better "bones" Hardwood frames vs. engineered wood stapled together, better springs, better padding
- More than a 5-7 year life span
- Ability to get
exactly what fabrics you want
- Ability to get style you want with or without variations to the "before" piece
- Much more attention to detail -- patterns centered, stripes and patterns on seams lined up,
I think I'll borrow that!
Another reason. One stop shopping. Instead of running all over town or traveling 50 miles away and still can't find the sofa with the fabric you have in mind, just visit your local upholstery shop. How easy is that. We'll even pick-up and deliver. We're doing a sofa and two wing chairs in Ceder Key. Her closest furniture store really is over 50 miles away.
Why reupholster? A few reasons are; there is a market for restoration, nostaligia, taste, and acceptability.
If the subject is furniture, many in the market hate the appearance of new furniture, they comment that is big, gaudy, cheaply made, and does not represent any classic periods of furniture. Overall, I also agree with comments like this from consumers.
Regarding auto restoration, that is simply part of the reason of old car restoration.
Recycling is upper most in some consumer minds.
The bottom line passed on to me is yes, new can be cheaper to buy, but if new is high quality then it is a new ball game. Most people today buying the cheaper new furniture cannot afford me to redo quality older furniture.
Keep all these ideas in mind as it plays a big part in marketing your skills.
I don't waste my time with peope who can't afford what I offer.
Just some ideas,
Good luck,
Doyle
It sounds good to me!
Sometimes the comparison between recovering, and buying new is like comparing apples to oranges.
I tell my customers all the time that if lowest price is their ONLY concern, they'll probably be happier just buying new.
Like others here have said, if they have a quality piece of furniture that was expensive when it was new, then they can get a better value by recovering it.
But if they have a $599 sofa, they may as well replace it. I've known people that are still making payments on a cheap sofa long after it has gone to the local landfill.
I've had a rash of pieces lately that I had previously recovered anywhere from 10-20 years ago. Still in good shape. Try doing that with "Rooms-to-go" crap.
Good point!
You may want to look at the 2012 MFA Time Standard Manual. You will probably take longer then the times stated, and it won't tell you how much to charge per hour, but it might be a good starting point.
http://marinefabricatormag.com/repository/6/13031/0112mf_timestandardsmanual12.pdf
Quote from: Upholstery Clinic on February 27, 2012, 10:28:13 am
You may want to look at the 2012 MFA Time Standard Manual. You will probably take longer then the times stated, and it won't tell you how much to charge per hour, but it might be a good starting point.
http://marinefabricatormag.com/repository/6/13031/0112mf_timestandardsmanual12.pdf
That's awesome! But what does 2 Bow, 3 Bow, 4 Bow, etc mean?
Quote from: florida girl on February 27, 2012, 10:40:22 am
That's awesome! But what does 2 Bow, 3 Bow, 4 Bow, etc mean?
How many bars/hoops/bows are in a convertible top. 2 bar is like a 'y', 3 is like a 'W', 4 is usually like 2 'y's back to back.
Ok, thanks!
Quote from: Peppy on February 27, 2012, 02:01:53 pm
Quote from: florida girl on February 27, 2012, 10:40:22 am
That's awesome! But what does 2 Bow, 3 Bow, 4 Bow, etc mean?
How many bars/hoops/bows are in a convertible top. 2 bar is like a 'y', 3 is like a 'W', 4 is usually like 2 'y's back to back.
Or Bimini.
;D
The MFA is a good GUIDE, I was estimating way under times, then I started using the guide, I was thinking my quotes where way to high, but still got most of the jobs :D
Suzi