Close to the epicenter

[baileyuph]

At this point, the focus should be on what happened!  Why can't everyone take their seat and let this thing play out?  There are two sides to every story, let it play out.

Media and politics and misinformation is making this situation worse today and for the future

Any contributions to the world of upholstery or is that of interest?

Doyle

[kodydog]

Kody,.  A few years ago you landed on me like a ton of scornful bricks and you commented that magazines like Vanity Fair and Rolling Stone were nothing more than "pop culture". 

I had to go back and re-read that post. It was fun to read where we were then and where we are now.
http://www.upholster.com/upholstery-forum/index.php?topic=11758.0

And by the way, I love Vanity Fair,

[Rich]

It's really, really easy to "blame" the media.  Too easy, in fact!  I guess that depends entirely on how you opt to view the media, however.

Sure, we need the news media and I'm sure many other countries have worse reporting than we have, but, It's so predictable the way news gets reported.
It's not so much what they report sometimes as what they leave out. The major news agencies wield so much power to form public opinion. What are people to believe when night after night, they tune in to the same news programs that report mainly (I'm being generous when I say "mainly") those stories that fit what they want their viewers to believe? If it were more balanced, then it would result in a better informed public, but that would not serve their interests, so certain stories get aired over and over again while others never quite get to see the light of day. Then, with a distorted opinion of the facts, people want to jump to a conclusion as soon as they hear of yet "another case of police brutality". As mentioned before, how is that officer ever going to get a not guilty verdict if he's truly innocent?
It seems today that you are seen as being part of a group that acts a certain way and not as an individual to be judged fairly on your own actions. And I believe the news media is a major factor in continuing that mindset.
Rich

[Rich]

Sofa, hope all goes well for you and your business and BTW-59 Bonneville.
Rich

[sofadoc]

I see the media as a sort of predatory animal. They watch the herd, select a weakling, and then go about the business of separating that weakling from the rest of the herd.

Once they've accomplished that, the herd that once offered protection to the weakling will now desert him.

I don't think there is any news service in the world that doesn't spin a story in a way that plays to their target audience.

I've seen a couple of local events get nationwide coverage in the last 20 years. It was frustrating to watch and read the important details that were left out simply because they would've made the story a little less extraordinary. So when I watch or read about any big news story, I'm always skeptical as to what they may have either omitted or embellished on.

Think about this for a moment. When you tell your friends about something unusual that happened to you, do you tend to leave out minor aspects that would make the story a little less sensational? Or if it's about an altercation that you were involved in, do you tell it in a way that totally exonerates you? I think we all do. It's human nature.

Sofa, hope all goes well for you and your business and BTW-59 Bonneville.
Rich

Thanks Rich. Looks like everything is cool here. You wouldn't believe how many locals will swear on their mother's grave that the car is an Edsel. But then, those same people were also all BFF's with Audie Murphy (hey, it's all about how you tell the story).

[kodydog]

And now for something completely different

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgNgJPX52fA&index=2&list=PLn2K6rez7mW5UHhkLY8ex9U8jEd2UDTvi

[Rich]

And now for something completely different

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgNgJPX52fA&index=2&list=PLn2K6rez7mW5UHhkLY8ex9U8jEd2UDTvi

Thanks for that Kody, I was riveted to my seat and I will never look at black bears in quite the same way again.
Absolutely superfluous!
Rich

[Darren Henry]

I don't think there is any news service in the world that doesn't spin a story

I totally agree, but what bothers me the most is when they try to dictate how you should feel or think about an issue. Take Cody's "news report"---They have darted at least 3 or 4 bears out of the oak tree behind me in my bio pick. No reporters. Heck my BBQ is in the other corner of the deck and unless they were wound for sound we finished our meal up on the deck. BUT, if the media had chosen to jazz the story up with only the facts that suggest that oak trees are the root cause of nuisance bears---how long would it be before some tree hugger had a petition at every check out in town calling for a ban on oak trees?

[Virgs Sew n Sew]

I don't think there is any news service in the world that doesn't spin a story

I totally agree, but what bothers me the most is when they try to dictate how you should feel or think about an issue. Take Cody's "news report"---They have darted at least 3 or 4 bears out of the oak tree behind me in my bio pick. No reporters. Heck my BBQ is in the other corner of the deck and unless they were wound for sound we finished our meal up on the deck. BUT, if the media had chosen to jazz the story up with only the facts that suggest that oak trees are the root cause of nuisance bears---how long would it be before some tree hugger had a petition at every check out in town calling for a ban on oak trees?

There's no easy answer to any of these questions.  We absolutely need free press so that we are given the facts in the situation.  Early on in Ferguson, two reporters were arrested for sitting in Mickey D's trying to use their free Wi-Fi to post their stories.  When they were finally released, they were never charged, no report was made -- yet they spent a significant amount of time behind bars.  What kind of crap is that?  On the other hand, I get really irritated with those reporters who spin stories to suit their political (or their station's political) views.  Miss Cronkite and those of his kind who gave us the news without bias or spin -- to quote Joe Friday, "Just the facts".

Also, it happens more than you would think that the media are not allowed into areas where there is a story that needs to be told.  Like Mayflower Arkansas when they had a tar sands oil leak.  Big oil came in and dictated a no fly zone and restricted access for media and darned if they didn't get it.  Pictures of the devastation the leaks caused were posted but they didn't get nearly the coverage they deserved, IMO.

The bottom line is that racial tensions are as bad, if not worse, in a lot of areas in America than they were in the 1960's before all of the race riots.  How we can fix that is beyond me.  I'm just saddened that groups like the KKK, skinheads and the like are thriving in the 21st Century.  As posted earlier, a young man died.  Who knows what kind of man he would have been had he lived.  I feel for his family for their loss.  I cannot imagine growing up as a young black person today.  Too often they are followed, just because of their skin color.  Can you imagine how you would feel if that were to happen to you and you had done nothing wrong?

Virginia

[Rich]

The bottom line is that racial tensions are as bad, if not worse, in a lot of areas in America than they were in the 1960's before all of the race riots.  How we can fix that is beyond me. 
Virginia[/quote]

That's something I would be very interested to hear evidence for. I think overall in America today, racial tensions are not what they were in the 60's. I do see bigotry coming from blacks against whites. Assumptions are made that because a person is white, they must be thinking a certain way, or their behavior must be motivated by attitudes that there's little evidence for (we have a black President and an Attorney General) or somehow, they have to keep making concessions for ill-treatment of blacks by our ancestors.
Meanwhile, I see glorification of poor attitudes in the black entertainment industry which if done by whites, would be considered bigotry. If it's a bad portrayal, it's bad no matter who does it.
I was reading an article in my local paper yesterday just opposite the article about Michael Browns funeral that said a casino company is opening casinos in low income cities in America. It's been proven that when a casino opens in an area, gambling increases in that area. Do low income people need to have yet another vice to siphon off their income and cause more social problems? And the police get blamed for causing problems? Where's the outrage over this?
In the funeral article, Al Sharpton was quoted as saying he has respect for the police, but he also said those police who are wrong need to be dealt with. Well, doesn't that statement assume he believes the office who shot and killed Michael Brown is guilty? Why would he even be there if he didn't think so? Maybe he should wait for the results of a full investigation?
Rich

[Virgs Sew n Sew]

The bottom line is that racial tensions are as bad, if not worse, in a lot of areas in America than they were in the 1960's before all of the race riots.  How we can fix that is beyond me. 
Virginia

That's something I would be very interested to hear evidence for. I think overall in America today, racial tensions are not what they were in the 60's. I do see bigotry coming from blacks against whites. Assumptions are made that because a person is white, they must be thinking a certain way, or their behavior must be motivated by attitudes that there's little evidence for (we have a black President and an Attorney General) or somehow, they have to keep making concessions for ill-treatment of blacks by our ancestors.
Meanwhile, I see glorification of poor attitudes in the black entertainment industry which if done by whites, would be considered bigotry. If it's a bad portrayal, it's bad no matter who does it.
I was reading an article in my local paper yesterday just opposite the article about Michael Browns funeral that said a casino company is opening casinos in low income cities in America. It's been proven that when a casino opens in an area, gambling increases in that area. Do low income people need to have yet another vice to siphon off their income and cause more social problems? And the police get blamed for causing problems? Where's the outrage over this?
In the funeral article, Al Sharpton was quoted as saying he has respect for the police, but he also said those police who are wrong need to be dealt with. Well, doesn't that statement assume he believes the office who shot and killed Michael Brown is guilty? Why would he even be there if he didn't think so? Maybe he should wait for the results of a full investigation?
Rich
[/quote]

I definitely agree with the attitudes portrayed in the entertainment industry, though I see it often times on both sides of the isle.  Check out Madonna, for example.  I love her singing but sheesh Grow Up Already.  Miley Cyrus comes to mind as well.  Then there is Rosanne Barr -- who could forget her crotch grabbing while singing the National Anthem at a Ball Game one year.  I get more than a little steamed when I hear a black "artist" whose rap consists of dropping the "n" word, calling women whores and other demeaning names

As far as things getting better, I just don't see that.  I see states like Texas, S. Carolina and think there is at least one more who are redistricting (less white Republicans in a heavily black Democratic area) but it will now be a Republican District -- how that can be done wobbles my mind) and also are working very hard at disenfranchising black votes by lessening voting hours, voting id's, etc.  Voter id laws really are ridiculous as there have been multiple studies and all concluded that the reasons stated for needing voter identification laws are just not happening.  SCOTUS struck down a portion of the Civil Rights Voting Act saying it wasn't necessary.  As soon as that happened, Texas and S. Carolina hopped in with the above actions, only proving why the Voting Rights Act was and should still be in place with no changes.  Also, the fact that the KKK is making a comeback in some areas, the number of skinheads and other hate groups is growing exponentially also points to an increase in racial tension.

Yes, we have a black President and a black AG and honestly, I have seen more racial slurs posted in comments on the internet since that happened than before.

Virginia

[Rich]

Also, the fact that the KKK is making a comeback in some areas, the number of skinheads and other hate groups is growing exponentially also points to an increase in racial tension.

I have to plead ignorance currently on the voting laws, but as far as the hate groups, I want to say right away that these groups are to be condemned harshly. Anyone who hates others is in the wrong place to begin with.
But, it's interesting to observe that it goes on and wonder why. We can usually get a handle on societal attitudes in general by looking at the actions of the extreme. Why are children killing? Is there something that is affecting all children causing the most unstable among them to act out? I think so. Likewise, is there something about the treatment of minority groups in America today that is causing the extemist hate groups to cry foul and act badly while most of the rest of the (currently anyway) majority sits and grumbles? I don't think what these hate groups do is reason to label  the majority negatively, but to watch the news reports, one could get the idea that race relations are worse than they actually are.
If given the opportunity, I'd like to ask a black person who complains about the sad state of race relations in this country today, "What bigotry have YOU encountered in the last few days? The last few months?" I wonder how many could give an actual personal account.
Rich

[Virgs Sew n Sew]

Also, the fact that the KKK is making a comeback in some areas, the number of skinheads and other hate groups is growing exponentially also points to an increase in racial tension.

I have to plead ignorance currently on the voting laws, but as far as the hate groups, I want to say right away that these groups are to be condemned harshly. Anyone who hates others is in the wrong place to begin with.
But, it's interesting to observe that it goes on and wonder why. We can usually get a handle on societal attitudes in general by looking at the actions of the extreme. Why are children killing? Is there something that is affecting all children causing the most unstable among them to act out? I think so. Likewise, is there something about the treatment of minority groups in America today that is causing the extemist hate groups to cry foul and act badly while most of the rest of the (currently anyway) majority sits and grumbles? I don't think what these hate groups do is reason to label  the majority negatively, but to watch the news reports, one could get the idea that race relations are worse than they actually are.
If given the opportunity, I'd like to ask a black person who complains about the sad state of race relations in this country today, "What bigotry have YOU encountered in the last few days? The last few months?" I wonder how many could give an actual personal account.
Rich

Grand Island doesn't have a lot of American blacks (born in the USA).  Because we house a large meat packing facility we have had an influx of Somalian and Sudanese immigrants in the last few years.  The house next door to us was for sale for over a year with no takers.  It was a little overpriced and needed some touch-up work that the owner wouldn't authorize.  I think the real reason it didn't sell was because of the house full of drunks across the street.  Every time there was a showing, at least 4 men in their 40's or 50's were laying out in the yard drunk as a skunk.  So, the house was auctioned off the first of the month.  A $40,000.00 loss from its value (identical to ours so I know its value).  The couple who bid the highest are either Somalian or Sudanese (not sure which).  4 of our neighbors were either standing on our porch or in the yard by the porch to watch the auction.  When the auctioneer announced they were the high bidder and our new neighbors, none of them joined me in going over to congratulate them.  Another neighbor was working and was quick to call us to inform us "What kind of person just became our next door neighbor?" -- his only rationale for complaining was that they were not white.  We've talked to this couple before and they seem nice enough.  My only complaints are that the wife walks 5 paces behind her spouse and she wears traditional dress while he has Americanized his clothing.  That's not uncommon as I see that frequently at the grocery store or the mall.  Anyway, that's the extreme prejudice that I've witnessed in our town.

Virginia

[Rich]

I suppose that all depends on where you live. My next door neighbor is black, across the street is a Hispanic family and down at the corner is another black. Quite honestly, I don't think of them as anything more or less than neighbors and I think my white neighbors feel the same way. Maybe it's because of our close proximity to Washington DC which has had mixed neighborhoods for years. But I'm thinking more than that it's the class of people who live here. Everyone has a job and keeps their properties neat and no one causes any problems for their neighbors. (Well, that's not entirely true, the symphony of yapping dogs belong to the white folks around me.)
When we lived in NYC, it was a different story. Now, you might think that NYC, being the melting pot it's been called since, forever, would be the same way, but there were many neighborhoods each with it's own predominant nationalities. We moved away 25 years ago and when we listed our house with the real estate agent, we were told in no uncertain terms by our next door neighbor that we better not sell to any n*****s or orientals. I also found out they had visited the RE office and threatened them and that explained why we were getting no visits from any more prospective buyers. (Today, that neighborhood is largely Haitian, Jamaican, black and West Indian and I think less bigoted than when it was largely Italian and Jewish.)
But, I think the bigotry I witnessed back in New York may have been due, as I mentioned before, to the difference in class. Twenty five years ago, many white people there saw the black people who lived a few miles away as lower class and did not want them moving into their neighborhoods and potentially lowering their property values. As it turns out, when the ethnic make up of the neighborhood did change, the property values continued to rise like everywhere else, so that idea proved to be unfounded. I think the attitude was "Black = low class", they didn't see it any other way.
Rich

[kodydog]

The bottom line is that racial tensions are as bad, if not worse, in a lot of areas in America than they were in the 1960's before all of the race riots.  

So does this mean the civil rights movement was all for naught. I say no. I'd say America has taken a drastic turn since the preachings of MLK. Why is there so much unrest in the black community and why after 50 years and over $15 trillion hasn't the government even made a dent in the war on poverty? America now has the highest poverty rate in over a generation.

"What good does it do to eat in the restaurant of your choice if you don't have the economic means to exercise it." MLK

Until 1965 85% of all black families had a man and a women raising children. That changed in just one decade. It's now 42%

70% of all government funds helping the poor go to administration. Also known as the poverty industrial complex. They measure their success on how much money is spent and how many people are on their programs. This may sound cynical but their jobs depend on people staying in poverty.

The general mindset is it's the governments job, send in your money, pay your taxes, and the government will fix it. But 50 years with no results makes the statement not true.

So whats the solution? The government should base success on outcome, how many people are getting out of poverty. This problem can be fixed, its not too late. The government needs to stop pushing away civil charities. they need to embrace churches, charities and civic groups who are in the trenches. For example transfer foster care back to the churches where it originated.

The government should support mentor programs like drug rehab groups. They should get some of the regulations out of the way like administrators who must have a collage degree instead of administrators who grew up in the hood and are recovering addicts themselves. They should support church programs that mentor children convincing them to stay in school and out of gangs. Instead they take power away from the church and support immoral groups that Americans disagree with.

"For decades, religious service providers have been told, "You're religious. You don't qualify. You can't even compete," in spite of the fact that our institutions, our social service providers, have done the best job, according to many social scientists, in helping people. Helping the inmate who's back on the street. Helping the drunk or the derelict. Helping the unwed mother who needs help. Our social service providers have done the best job, the most effectively, at the least cost. Yet for decades, we've been told, "You don't qualify." That's simply not the American way. ..." Richard Land

"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem." Ronald Reagan