The main product of my business is fitness equipment upholstery, handles,wall padding and any thing else a gym would need. Over the past year, I have turned down restaurant booth work, since it would require a small investment in tools and the like. After being asked to make two 21-ft long banquettes for a local restaurant, I have decided it would be a good idea to add restaurant work to my business.
We will be using zigzag springs for the backs and seats, and my question is: What are the must have tools for this?
There are a lot of items out there, and they are not cheap! I would hate to purchase a tool I didn't need.
Thanks all for your help!
You can cut Zig-Zag springs with an ordinary pair of bolt cutters. It would be nice to have an Osborne spring end former. Here's "your's truly" demonstrating one:
(https://forum.upholster.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi775.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy33%2Fsofadoc%2Fth_MOV00133.jpg&hash=18eb4c8957bba059ad956aa7c673680d) (http://s775.photobucket.com/albums/yy33/sofadoc/?action=view¤t=MOV00133.mp4)
The springs need to be "stabilized" by joining them together. There are 2 basic ways.
You can tie them together with spring twine. Or you can join them with stake wire.
You can use BW pliers and clips, or invest in a pneumatic clinching gun:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ub69I7GTJjI
Other than these items, there aren't a whole lot of "must haves" (assuming you already have a sewing machine and stapler).
You will also need ziggar clips to attach to the frame and place the ends of the spring in. Use stronghold nails with these and make sure the clips have a insulator in them (piece of paper) that stops squeaks.
I use a hand made hook to stretch the spring on. It is just a piece of edgewire about 2' long, one end is bent into a U and the other is threaded though a 1" about 4" long dowel and bent around it to hold. Works great for many years.
What will you be building these booths out of?
Paul's homemade spring stretcher will certainly work fine. But since you asked about specialty tools:
(https://forum.upholster.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi775.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy33%2Fsofadoc%2Fth_MOV00217.jpg&hash=bc16ebeabc08bee4edc056803ac088d6) (http://s775.photobucket.com/albums/yy33/sofadoc/?action=view¤t=MOV00217.mp4)
Again though, not a "must have". But it's only around 30 bucks.
Here's my homemade one:
(https://forum.upholster.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi775.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy33%2Fsofadoc%2Fth_DSC00266.jpg&hash=de3b5ad4b75e466edcfff6cd494a2d7d) (http://s775.photobucket.com/albums/yy33/sofadoc/?action=view¤t=DSC00266.jpg)
I can't say anyone has ever asked me to build a booth from scratch but I can see how a 21' banquette would certainly be a custom job.
You can buy rolls of springs and make them yourself.
Lets say your placing the springs 9" apart. That would be 28 springs per banquette. your looking at 112 ends that need to be bent back so the spring will not click when someone sits on them. And that's just for the seats.
Sofas spring edge former will pay for itself with this one job. Or you will spend hours bending them by hand one at a time.
Not to rain on anyone's parade but I never found the need to bend a zigger after cutting them. I would cut the spring right after a bend leaving maybe 1/8" to 1/4" past the bend and never had any problems with noise. They locked down nicely and wouldn't slide out of the clip.
Is it zigger or ziggar? :-[
Quote from: MinUph on July 09, 2012, 07:01:44 pm
Is it zigger or ziggar?
Until I joined this forum, I had never heard them called zigger or ziggar. I prefer No-sag.
But then before I joined this forum, I'd never heard of chip strip, slip seats, or a fox edge either.
Thanks all, very helpful :-* The banquette will be made out of 1/2 and 3/4in plywood with L-shaped corners on the ends.
I will post some pics during the project. I'm on the fence as to what thickness of foam to use for the seats. Any recommendations? I will be using burlap, deck pad (carpet padding), HR foam and batting.
Also, I like the look of a mitered corner for the L-shaped end, but, I'm finding it poses some challenges when using zig-zag springs. Has anyone done this before?
Are you going to be attaching the Zig-zag clips to the plywood?
Yes, the clips will be attached to the plywood
It wouldn't hurt to have the right angle clips like the one on the left:
(https://forum.upholster.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi775.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy33%2Fsofadoc%2Fth_DSC00338.jpg&hash=67045e247d717d7282de7cafdfb2883e) (http://s775.photobucket.com/albums/yy33/sofadoc/?action=view¤t=DSC00338.jpg)
There's a lot of tension on the springs. Plywood isn't the best wood for holding the clips.
The right angle clips will be less likely to pull out of the wood.
I've not heard this aspect anywhere else, but Kreg jig suggest using
- coarse thread screws on plywood and softwoods
- fine thread screws on hardwood.
There is some highly technical information on screw holding power in
http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplgtr/fplgtr190/chapter_08.pdf
The most relevant (IMO) is the statement "The withdrawal resistance of type A tapping screws, commonly called sheet metal screws, is in general about 10% greater than that for wood screws of comparable diameter and length of threaded portion. The ratio between the withdrawal resistance of tapping screws and wood screws varies from 1.16 in denser woods, such as oak, to 1.05 in lighter woods, such as redwood."
and
"Within limits, the withdrawal load varies directly with the depth of penetration of the threaded portion and the diameter of the screw, provided the screw does not fail in tension. The screw will fail in tension when its strength is exceeded by the withdrawal strength from the wood. The limiting length to cause a tension failure decreases as the density of the wood increases since the withdrawal strength of the wood increases with density. The longer lengths of standard screws are therefore superfluous in dense hardwoods."
{translation} longer screws hold better up to the point where the screw fractures.
For repair jobs on broken or dismounted clips, I just use 1" drywall screws. Since the original clip was anchored with nails, I use the old nail holes as pilot holes. To my knowledge, none of my repairs have failed.
There was a big video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lldPT_u5hwE)on this that I watched last night. As you might imagine, there are nearly religious opinions on drywall screws (see the comments). The conclusion was (from a purely objective point of view) is that they hold well in softwoods, but are brittle.
Personally, I cringe when I see drywall screws in factory furniture.
http://howstuffcompares.com/doc/d/drywall-screw-vs-wood-screw.htm
Quote from: sofadoc on July 10, 2012, 05:54:31 pm
For repair jobs on broken or dismounted clips, I just use 1" drywall screws. Since the original clip was anchored with nails, I use the old nail holes as pilot holes. To my knowledge, none of my repairs have failed.
You could say,
p= 15,700 * G^2 * D * L (in - lb)
where p is maximum withdrawal load (N, lb), G specific gravity based on ovendry weight and volume at 12% moisture content, D shank diameter of the screw ( in.), and L length of penetration of the threaded part of the screw ( in.).
The pics of the homemade stretcher were very helpful. Just got the materials in today, and I'm in the process of making a homemade spring bender as well!
Based on all the detailed feedback regarding fasteners, I'm looking at using a combo of nails and screws as well.
I was fortunate enough to come across some maple wood for practically nothing at Habitat for Humanity, cheaper than ply, will be using for the booth project.
On another note, I'm practicing posting pics, so, here is my sewing table I made that I'm pretty darn proud of
(https://forum.upholster.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1162.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq537%2Fkpohorylo%2Fth_sewingtable005.jpg&hash=ff1972d8a8d5f13ece2e0b5818e39835) (http://s1162.photobucket.com/albums/q537/kpohorylo/?action=view¤t=sewingtable005.jpg)
Custom sewing table
Your skills at building the sewing machine table certainly indicate that you'll have no trouble building some quality restaurant booths. Good luck!
K
Really nice sewing table. Well thought out, built and very functional.
Quote from: sofadoc on July 09, 2012, 05:28:00 pm
Paul's homemade spring stretcher will certainly work fine. But since you asked about specialty tools:
(https://forum.upholster.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi775.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy33%2Fsofadoc%2Fth_MOV00217.jpg&hash=bc16ebeabc08bee4edc056803ac088d6) (http://s775.photobucket.com/albums/yy33/sofadoc/?action=view¤t=MOV00217.mp4)
Again though, not a "must have". But it's only around 30 bucks.
Here's my homemade one:
(https://forum.upholster.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi775.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy33%2Fsofadoc%2Fth_DSC00266.jpg&hash=de3b5ad4b75e466edcfff6cd494a2d7d) (http://s775.photobucket.com/albums/yy33/sofadoc/?action=view¤t=DSC00266.jpg)
So helpful sofadoc. Going to try and make one, will send some pics..
Very nice sewing table...where did you get the base?
Quote from: jojo on July 14, 2012, 01:28:44 pm
Very nice sewing table...where did you get the base?
Thanks Jojo... Actually, I made the base out of 11 gauge steel, fully welded, so there is no sag at all. Also, I added some dense carpet padding between the top and the steel to absorb sound and vibration, and what a difference that made! I used automotive paint with a sprayer for a smooth glossy finish.
I bought a welder about 2 years ago, and I can't tell you how many times I have used it, for both business and personal. A good investment..
Just a question, why are you putting springs in? most restaurant seating is just good quality high density foam (usually about 4'').
Build a base - usually about 14'' high.(for a total finished height of about 18'') divide your banquette size into say four foot sections, this way when a piece gets damaged you only have to replace part of it.upholster each section and block it it place. We usually make seats 18 - 20''
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f106/2eagles/010.jpg
sorry I can't remember how to post pics but if you can get on this photobucket link there are a couple of pics of a small restaurant we built last year.
Lynn